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Which WCW/ECW performer was most negatively effected by their companies closing?


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#41 Loss

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 04:41 PM

I think I read at the time that Vince chewed HHH out because he didn't like the way he worked the posedown angle going into the Rumble, but I guess that was quickly forgotten.

#42 NintendoLogic

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 04:46 PM

DDP was in his mid-40s and moved around pretty well for a guy that age until WWE made him start flat back bumping. He was done in months. Also, no way would Flair have lasted as long as he did bumping flat on his back, considering that he didn't work a light style and he was thrown around quite a bit. Also, look at lucha and how many guys can have long careers because they don't do that.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand. DDP is an excellent pick. Went from headliner to joke who couldn't even wrestle anymore in record time after WWE decided to fix something not broken.


I thought it was neck problems that ended DDP's career. I don't know that bumping on your back would have much to do with those.

Anyway, after thinking about it, I think you'd have to add Guerrero and Benoit to the conversation since there's a strong argument that going to the WWE was directly responsible for their deaths.

#43 Mad Dog

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 04:49 PM

I disagree with that. Guerrero was pretty fucked up at points of his WCW run due to the party atmosphere and Benoit went crazy from brain damage. I think there might be a slight argument for Guerrero but I think Benoit destroyed his brain doing the diving head butt. Benoit was going to do that no matter who he was under contract to.

#44 Loss

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 04:54 PM

DDP was in his mid-40s and moved around pretty well for a guy that age until WWE made him start flat back bumping. He was done in months. Also, no way would Flair have lasted as long as he did bumping flat on his back, considering that he didn't work a light style and he was thrown around quite a bit. Also, look at lucha and how many guys can have long careers because they don't do that.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand. DDP is an excellent pick. Went from headliner to joke who couldn't even wrestle anymore in record time after WWE decided to fix something not broken.


I thought it was neck problems that ended DDP's career. I don't know that bumping on your back would have much to do with those.


Flat back bumping can cause concussions. It can most certainly cause neck problems.

#45 NintendoLogic

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 05:55 PM

DDP was in his mid-40s and moved around pretty well for a guy that age until WWE made him start flat back bumping. He was done in months. Also, no way would Flair have lasted as long as he did bumping flat on his back, considering that he didn't work a light style and he was thrown around quite a bit. Also, look at lucha and how many guys can have long careers because they don't do that.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand. DDP is an excellent pick. Went from headliner to joke who couldn't even wrestle anymore in record time after WWE decided to fix something not broken.


I thought it was neck problems that ended DDP's career. I don't know that bumping on your back would have much to do with those.


Flat back bumping can cause concussions. It can most certainly cause neck problems.


From Dave's Misawa obit:

"Most likely, if he had gone to a doctor in the U.S., like Steve Austin or DDP did when they had serious neck injuries, his level of his neck damage would have been discovered. It’s very possible, if not likely, he’d have been told, like Austin, DDP and Ted DiBiase had, that one more bad bump could leave him as a paraplegic. DiBiase retired at that point, although in the last year has talked of coming back for one last match. Austin and DDP wrestled a few times after that diagnosis, but got out for good, in the case of Austin, spurning some huge offers to come back, and at times considering them."

I'm no doctor, but I would think it would take more than a few months of flat back bumps to jack up someone's neck to that degree. I'm not saying that it had no impact at all, mind you.

EDIT: After reading up some more, it seems that what actually ended DDP's career was the neck injury he sustained in this match against Hardcore Holly on Smackdown:



Check out the superplex at 3:44. Ouch.

Also, I was under the impression that the main reason for luchadores bumping the way they do is the fact that the mats in Mexico are a lot harder than in the US and Japan.

#46 Loss

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 06:30 PM

Yes, but WWE mats got really hard when they were on NBC.

#47 sek69

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 06:58 PM

Wasn't the deal with Sean O'Haire that they were punishing him because Piper (who he was inexplicably teamed with after the awesome vignettes before his debut) went on some show and bashed Vince/WWE?

#48 Cox

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Posted 19 February 2012 - 07:01 PM

Wasn't the deal with Sean O'Haire that they were punishing him because Piper (who he was inexplicably teamed with after the awesome vignettes before his debut) went on some show and bashed Vince/WWE?

That was a second time where they had buried O'Haire. They had taken him off of TV for a while during the invasion, were set to bring him back after Wrestlemania 19, gave him weeks of hypes with those vignettes, before his push died again.

#49 Magnum Milano

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 04:51 AM

Anyway, after thinking about it, I think you'd have to add Guerrero and Benoit to the conversation since there's a strong argument that going to the WWE was directly responsible for their deaths.

But they didn't go to the WWF because their company closed though.

I don't agree with Shane Helms at all. The guy ended up having a nigh on nine year run with the WWE and with the exception of Chavo, out of the initial 24 contracts that the WWF picked up, he had the longest tenure of anyone. Nine years of regular, solid income, can't say he did too bad out of WCW closing.

Corino suffered in more ways than one. He either had, or was scheduled to, sign with WCW (after Dusty pushed for him) right before the company closed (I've seen his shoot interview, but forget the specifics). When WWF purchased the company, he was no longer required. He's had a decent run on the Indys and I am guessing made a good living, but it would have been no where near the same had WCW not died.

I've seen a few of the younger wrestlers mentioned, but Kid Romeo and Reno (Rick Cornell) pretty much vanished into obscurity. Picked up by the WWF, then sent to HWA, I think they had a couple of dark matches each, released, and not heard from again.

#50 JerryvonKramer

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:18 AM

How about Arn Anderson as an on-air personality? I am sure that if WCW was still going Arn, as an NWA/Crockett/ WCW guy would be on screen a hell of a lot more. I mean how many times did the WWE acknowledge the Flair - Arn connection during Flair's last run? Two times? Three?

#51 El-P

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:57 AM

Corino suffered in more ways than one. He either had, or was scheduled to, sign with WCW (after Dusty pushed for him) right before the company closed (I've seen his shoot interview, but forget the specifics). When WWF purchased the company, he was no longer required. He's had a decent run on the Indys and I am guessing made a good living, but it would have been no where near the same had WCW not died.


I doubt he would have amounted to anything in WCW. Too small, too "indie", too referential. He would have been lost in the shuffle. Maybe Dusty would have pushed for him a bit, but that would only help him so much. Like FLIK said, Corino had a very nice career in Japan and was a lot more successful than any other ECW guys not picked up (or even picked up) by WWF. Corino had quite a successful post ECW career actually. The same can't be said for guys like Justin Credible or C.W. Anderson.

#52 Marty

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 08:28 AM

Yeah, I thought of Corino, but when I saw what he did post-ECW, I couldn't justify choosing him like I chose Credible. Thought about DDP as far as picking one from WCW, but even in spite of the stupid stalker angle, he managed to turn some chicken shit into chicken salad and even had a pretty good Mania match with Christian. Kanyon, on the other hand, was little more than a footnote alongside DDP in the InVasion angle (in spite of that one title win) and his most notable thing afterwards was the horrid Boy George bit. He was being used pretty solidly as WCW neared its end, too, and I don't think his career ever recovered after WCW's doors closed. Same feeling for Credible: pushed strongly in ECW, never the same afterwards (You can make the argument as to why he was pushed in ECW, of course, but point being is that it never happened again after that, which I gathered what this topic was about).

#53 El-P

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 09:33 AM

DDP was 45 when WCW went under. So it's not like he had tons of mileage left, but he could have been used much better for sure.

#54 Dylan Waco

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 10:48 AM

Credible was just awful as an act and had already gone far beyond what his skills merited in being ECW Champion. I suppose he technically fits the criteria because Heyman had a hard on for him and he probably would have been a main eventer in ECW for some time going forward. But he's not a guy who I think was cheated out of anything by ECW going under. I love C.W. Anderson and he was on the rise in ECW so he's a reasonable answer, though I'm not sure he was ever going to be able to break through on a consistent basis

#55 El-P

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 10:59 AM

Credible had a stupid name and a stupid gimmick, and was a pretty bad promo in this setting, but he was a solid worker if nothing less, and a fine bumping heel. He should have been repackaged. That less talented guys like Lance Storm and Spike Dudley (yes, in the same sentence) got more out of their post ECW career is a bit of a shame, really. He could have been fine working undercards in WCW for years. Ditto C.W. Anderson, way too good to just vanish. WCW was the right fit for him. Really, the death of WCW is a tragedy for US wrestlers, no matter how much some people want you to remember it only as this god-awful promotion.

#56 JerryvonKramer

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 11:01 AM

I'm convinced that if ECW had never existed and it was just WWF and WCW, Credible would never have risen above jobber status. There's a lot of ECW guys in that bracket I reckon.

#57 El-P

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 11:08 AM

That's why ECW was cool. It gave an opportunity to guys the big two wouldn't even batch an eye at.

#58 The Thread Killer

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 01:23 PM

...Kanyon, on the other hand, was little more than a footnote alongside DDP in the InVasion angle (in spite of that one title win) and his most notable thing afterwards was the horrid Boy George bit...


I hate to disagree Marty, but I distinctly remember the man being named the Invasion and Alliance MVP. :P

#59 Loss

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 01:32 PM

Quite the honor. It hasn't gone to very many people.

#60 Dylan Waco

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Posted 20 February 2012 - 01:54 PM

Credible had a stupid name and a stupid gimmick, and was a pretty bad promo in this setting, but he was a solid worker if nothing less, and a fine bumping heel. He should have been repackaged. That less talented guys like Lance Storm and Spike Dudley (yes, in the same sentence) got more out of their post ECW career is a bit of a shame, really. He could have been fine working undercards in WCW for years. Ditto C.W. Anderson, way too good to just vanish. WCW was the right fit for him.

Really, the death of WCW is a tragedy for US wrestlers, no matter how much some people want you to remember it only as this god-awful promotion.


Since you brought it up, there wasn't a single thing Credible did better than Spike other than talk on the mic which is a win by default. His bumping was his strong suit and he was not a bad worker, but he was not a particularly good one either.




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