The Destroyer

[Grimmas]

Discuss here.

[Timbo Slice]

Man, the Baba matches are tremendous. Some of the most fun 60's/70's stuff you'll see. He'll be on my list.

[WingedEagle]

I kind of feel the same way, but it raises a question that's been in the back of my mind here -- how many matches is enough to rank someone, let alone highly? We may have more Flair in a given month than from Destroyer's prime, or pre-80s Bockwinkel. Not quite sure yet how to balance that or when I'll be comfortable saying I've seen "enough" of someone.

[Tim Cooke]

There is a good amount of Destroyer out there. I'll compile a full list over the weekend. But off the top of my head, you get the 63 match vs. Rikidozen, 65 vs. Toyonobori, 69 vs. Baba, 73 and 74 against Mascaras. That five match sample is over an 11 year period and at the very least, a good starting point. I'd rather see different timeframes than have a bunch of footage over one smaller period.

[Loss]

He also had a match against Don Leo Jonathan in 1975 that is probably a good look at both guys.

[elliott]

I remember really liking the Don Leo Jonathon match. Its not at the level of the Baba or Mil matches. The Stan Hansen match from 75 is good. That one is cool to see Destroyer working with a less experienced guy. And Hansen's hair in that match is ridiculous. I really liked the Horst Hoffman match but it was a little on the short side as I recall. Isn't there a 3rd match with Mil from 77 that wasn't quite as good? And an Abdullah match. I can't remember if there was anything else on the Best of Destroyer tapes I had made 13 years ago. Its not a ton of footage obviously but there are some long matches and Destroyer does a lot of different stuff in each match. He's someone I'm going to revisit and probably end up ranking really high. Everyone needs to see the 60min draw with Baba.

[fxnj]

Some huge Mil Mascaras fan on Youtube uploaded 2 more Mil matches from 1977 and another from 1978, plus a build-up tag between them. I think those definitely help flesh out his case by showing what they did outside of the much more widely seen 1973 and 1974 matches.

 

It also pisses me off that there's footage of him teaming with with Robinson against Baba and Jumbo that got taken down.

[BillThompson]

I'd love a list of Destroyer to check out, I've never seen a match of his, which makes me kind of sad I know.

[khawk20]

I've come across a match and some highlights of his 1982 work for Cannon's Superstars vs. Gino Brito that I can comment on when I get it in.

 

Would his match vs. Verne in 1968 for the AWA title count here? He worked the Dr. X gimmick there as opposed to the Destroyer, but to me Beyer is Beyer. It's short but it's something from a prime part of his career.

 

If it does fit, there is a bit of film of him teaming with Andre against Bock and Stevens from Chicago available. Dr. X was a big deal in the AWA and should not be discounted.

 

Someone needs to get in touch with Steve Yohe and see if he has a Gordy List of some sort available for Beyer, just to educate those of us that know of him, but might not really know what he's all about.

[Lee Casebolt]

I don't see why the Dr. X stuff wouldn't count. A change of gimmick doesn't make him a different person. Bill Eadie's work counts whether he's Ax or Masked Superstar, right? Same thing.

[khawk20]

I agree, but it isn't my call, just throwing it out there.

 

Some other older Destroyer footage from Japan that would probably merit watching for those with Beyer on their radar:

 

2/26/69: Toyonobori vs. The Destroyer (WWA title) (JWA Classics # 5)

3/5/69: Giant Baba vs. The Destroyer (JWA Classics #7)

[soup23]

His stuff as Dr. X would count and I cant fathom an argument as to why it wouldn't. We are voting for the greatest wrestler, not the greatest one gimmick.

[khawk20]

As such, Dr. X vs. Verne for the AWA title on 8/31/68 is available. It's short (about 5 minutes) but worth a look.

[soup23]

Destroyer is a really tough guy to rank. He has enough footage for me to be on my list and of the matches I have seen of his, I can't think of a performance I would consider even meh, but when you start to get down to the top quarter of my ballot, there is a lot of great wrestlers that had multiple great matches and it may become a quantity argument against Dick.

[Childs]

Destroyer is one of those guys I've never liked as much as I feel I'm supposed to. He'll be getting a revisit for sure.

[shoe]

That 69 match against Baba is required viewing. I like the Mil matches, but felt the mat work on the 1st fall of the 1st match kinda was just there. It didn't have any real impact. It was cool looking, but lacked a hook.

 

One of his biggest strengths is his character work. He's also one of the great audio wrestlers.

 

I just rewatched his match with Hiro Matsuda and really liked it. The mat work was really good and told a story. The results of the mat work had consequences. The match mixed in a variety of strikes.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4T14M_J6Lo

[shoe]

He also wrestled a bear so that's a check in the positive side.

[Guest si oem]

.

[Loss]

I thought "intelligent" and "sensational" were just words the tOA crowd made up to describe him for years, not realizing that "The Intelligent, Sensational Destroyer" was actually how he was billed in some places. That made me love him even more.

[jdw]

Steve is part of the tOA crowd. He explained that Dick at some point told Lane and/or London to introduce him as the Sensational Destroyer. Then after a while told them to add Intelligent. Or the other way around. Dick was a smart heel.

[JerryvonKramer]

I have to reset my iPad, so posting any unposted reviews I have buried in notepad.

 

The Destroyer vs. Giant Baba (3/5/69)

 

No play by play for these longer matches, just going to watch and take in and then provide analysis. Destroyer, for those not familiar, wears a white mask with quite an open mouth area through which you can see the gap in his teeth. This gives him kind of a Jim Breaks vibe and like Breaks he's very vocal and an obvious heel. Baba is Baba who never seems to age or change or anything. Looks exactly the same as any other time you've seen him. Inoki looking like a Japanese Elvis is in Baba's corner; Destroyer has an assortment of cowboys, one I think is Cowboy Bob Ellis, in his. Another one really looks like Bill Watts.

 

First off, The Destroyer is obviously legit awesome. He's a consummate heel constantly jawing, stooging, cheating, doing nasty shit and so on. He does the phantom object stuff as well as anyone I've ever seen. This whole match is worked super snug, and it has very nasty hand and finger work, especially in the early portion. Destroyer biting on the fingers while choking Baba out is a superb bit of ... Double cheating! Baba actually catches colour here, which I haven't seen him do a lot from a headbutt with a loaded mask. The matwork is top notch here. I was expecting this to be dry as fuck,Mubi it wasn't at all and the hour flew by. Destroyer is just a supremely engaging worker and the early comparison I made to Jim Breaks is one that holds: just one of those incredibly natural talents. This is has a reputation of being the premier match worked in this style and I can't really disagree. My only qualm is that the finish was straight dogshit. Destroyer goes in the the figure four he's been trying to hook for the entire match, gets it, Baba submits and that makes it 1-1, then Inoki comes in, the American cronies come in, the ref ends up getting punched and DQs Destroyer. Baba gets the big trophy and ceremony but surely he can't be happy with that victory and it kinda makes him look like a bitch chump winning on a technicality. Not a fan of that booking and it does enough to bring this one down from the highest rating. Still, this is is a must watch match.

 

****3/4

 

The Destroyer vs. Antonio Inoki (5/19/71)

 

As ever with Inoki, it depends which Inoki turns up, but I want to see what he could do with Rikidozan's other protégé.

 

I really didn't get a lot out of this to be honest. Destroyer did some neat stuff here and there, but mostly this bored me to tears just like every other Inoki match I've ever seen. How did the guy become such a superstar when he was soooo boring? Literally just sits in holds and does nothing to keep them interesting.

 

***

[bennyowens]

A sure fire lock to make my list, if this was a list of favourites he'd probably be top 10.

The 73 Mascaras match is my number one match of the 70s, and the 69 Baba match is a masterpiece.

One of the all time greats at talking during a match. Whether he's barking at the fans, berating the referee, shouting at his opponent's seconds, he always knew when to throw some character work in while doing something simple like working a hold.

I havent watched any Dr X stuff yet, but checked out some of his pre mask work and he seems like a guy that just 'gets' wrestling, whatever role he is in.

 

 

[DylanZero]

Absolutely love what he brought to the table and clearly on an era-for-era basis one of the most talented of all time and stylistically his mat game has always appealed to me, and I also love how he emotes and plays his character in his matches makes me think you could get more from him if you're NOT a fan of this style than you could from some of his contemporaries.

 

We're farther and farther removed from his peak but he's a lock for my list.

[Clayton Jones]

I thought the Rikidozan match added quite a bit to his resume since it makes the case he was flat out great for at least a decade+. I am curious to explore what Dr X footage we have and I've honestly never actively watched any of his later AJPW legend stuff, I'd skip over him and Baba on tapes if they showed up when I was younger. So I guess that stuff could potentially really cool me off on him, but after my first round of viewing and already loving a few of his matches coming into this, I'm curious what the argument is against him? Not as a candidate, which I think is undeniable, but as a top level one? Is it just footage? It seems to me that's not really that much of an issue all things considered.

[strobogo]

Destroyer stuff into the 80s will not cool you off on him, but probably won't raise him much in your estimation, either. He's pretty much doing all of his classic stuff but there are no stakes to anything so it's skippable fluff altogether. He's just as talented and capable deep into the 80s as he was in the 50s/60s/70s, though. Probably into the 90s if I had to guess.