Superstar Sleeze Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 I believe that the change is more important the destination in this progress. How we have changed because the additional footage we have watched over the course of the year and how we view that footage and how are beliefs change are the real values of the project. The "ultimate" list that this produces will be static and representative of a time period. Pro wrestling is dynamic. One of the many reasons I love pro wrestling is that it never ends. So how can any list produced about a dynamic form of entertainment ever be considered final. Thus a static list measuring a dynamic quantity is on its own useless unless there are static lists that document the changes in time. One could argue that 2006 Smarkschoice Poill is the baseline. Well I did not take part in that poll so FUCK THAT POLL! I am kidding, I am kidding. As an example of what dramatic things can change in an eight year period, my feelings on John Cena has radically changed. In 2006, I hated John Cena with a passion. Man alive, I bought into every single bit of smarky bullshit especially the fact that he was a "bad" wrestler. Fast forward 8 years and I think Cena is one of the best in-ring workers (his character & out of ring work tends to suck more often than not in my opinion, but that is for another thread). I would actually rank Cena as one of the top 25 workers of all time. Now, what would have been interesting is if I documented that on a year to year basis. I know 2011 with Punk is when I started to turn the corner on him. Or how my brother loves to throw in my face "Remember when you loved The Miz and hated Sheamus". 2010 was a bad year for me folks, but it should have been documented! I think an additional baseline would help because it will show how much from the start to finish there was a change. Next argument would be that initial lists could cause influence, group think or convergence. However, we are all promoting what we love anyways so why no fully categorize. I have not fully exploited Dylan's list yet when he did for Wrestling Culture #50, but when he ranked Yuki Ishikawa (a guy who had never even heard of) and Tatsumi Fujinami at #5ish (I have seen like 3 Fujinami matches), it was a wake up call. So when I was doing Ditch's 00s project, I highlighted to make sure to watch every Ishikawa match and they have been tremendous (in two of my current top 10) and I bought New Japan set first so I can see what Fujinami is all about. That's how an initial list can be valuable in guiding our watching. So have at it. I will post one later in the week because I am at work and should be doing work, but I am committed to this viewpoint. It is going to be a crazy list, but hell it is only more fun that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 This is a topic I considered making earlier last week. I'm certain my top 100 will be very different come deadline time. Will post my working 100 sometime in the near future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Sleeze Posted October 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Charles or Will, could you please change it to "Who Are Your Top 100 Right Now?". A person in my position can not afford to look ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Actually I think "Top 100" is technically singular so "is" would be correct. The Top 100 is a singular item that refers to a collective ... as in "What is your team?" If still anxious could go for this as a work around: "Who is in Your Top 100 Right Now"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Sleeze Posted October 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Parv, I was thinking that because it is a collective term, but it sounded weird to me because we are ranking 100 wrestlers. Lets leave it be then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shoe Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Actually I think "Top 100" is technically singular so "is" would be correct. The Top 100 is a singular item that refers to a collective ... as in "What is your team?" If still anxious could go for this as a work around: "Who is in Your Top 100 Right Now"? An excellent Parv's point . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Footage wise, I only have 35 guys on my list I feel really confident about. I don't count, let's say, Stan Hansen on that, because I haven't seen enough. I'm pretty certain he'll make my list, but i don't feel confident putting him on yet. I will in a year or two. On the other hand, a guy who would make my top 100 right now, like John Tenta, I don't feel confident to think he'll be on the final list. He might, but I'm not confident of that. to the point where putting in the effort right now feels futile. So i have 35 guys right now I feel pretty confident about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillThompson Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 So, it will be a while before I provide my list because for the second time in as many days my computer decided to eat it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soup23 Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Made a prelim list of slam dunk guys. These are guys I feel I have seen enough of and there is around 3% chance or less they wouldn't be in my top 100. I was selective in not adding any joshi, WOS or hardly any shoot guys as I feel those are the areas with my biggest blind spots. 1. Misawa 2. Kawada 3. Kobashi 4. Taue 5. Atlantis 6. Bobby Eaton 7. Bret Hart 8. Buddy Rose 9. Chris Benoit 10. El Dandy 11. Daniel Bryan 12. Eddie Guerrero 13. Genechiro Tenryu 14. El Hijo Del Santo 15. Jerry Lawler 16. John Cena 17. Jumbo Tsurtua 18. Jun Akiyama 19. Jushin Liger 20. Kiyoshi Tamura 21. Negro Casas 22. Nick Bockwinkel 23. Randy Savage 24. Rey Mysterio Jr. 25. Ric Flair 26. Ricky Morton 27. Ricky Steamboat 28. Riki Choshu 29. El Satanico 30. Shawn Michaels 31. Shinya Hashimoto 32. Stan Hansen 33. Tatsumi Fujinami 34. Terry Funk 35. Volk Han 36. Vader Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Yeah, if Chad will post his slam dunk guys, I will as well. Nick Bockwinkel Buddy Rose Ric Flair Jerry Lawler Arn Anderson Tully Blanchard Dustin Rhodes Steven/William Regal Fit Finlay Andre the Giant Bret Hart Ricky Steamboat Rick Martel Tito Santana Barry Windham Jim Brunzell Rey Mysterio, Jr. Bill Eadie Steve Austin Billy Robinson Terry Funk Ricky Morton Bobby Eaton Christian Satanico Hijo Del Santo Negro Casas Blue Panther El Dandy Randy Savage Eddie Guerrero Roddy Piper Mark Henry Perro Aguayo Bill Dundee 35 to his 36. Even then, I could see some of those last few guys ending up off the ballot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soup23 Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Arn, Tully, Regal, Finlay are my first four off of the slam dunk list currently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Arn is a really great Matt D style wrestler. Regal is another. Tully is a possible drop for me, I'll admit it. Finlay is admittedly fresh on my mind with the Thatcher match. I almost included Taue to be funny. I was trying to make a list small enough where I couldn't be disingenuous with anyone, but there are a few guys (like Austin) I really need to revisit even in THAT list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR Ackermann Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 I went through the list of people I have as potentially being on my final ballot and selected all the ones I see making my list for sure and surprise, surprise, it came out to 36 guys. There are probably 20 or 30 more that I'm 90% sure will make it, but these are the ones I'm 100% on at this point. 1. 2 Cold Scorpio 2. Akira Taue 3. Barry Windham 4. Bill Dundee 5. Billy Robinson 6. Bobby Eaton 7. Bret Hart 8. Daisuke Ikeda 9. Dick Murdoch 10. Dustin Rhodes 11. Eddie Guerrero 12. El Satanico 13. Genichiro Tenryu 14. Greg Valentine 15. Jerry Lawler 16. John Cena 17. Jumbo Tsuruta 18. Jun Akiyama 19. Kenta Kobashi 20. Mitsuharu Misawa 21. Nick Bockwinkel 22. Ric Flair 23. Ricky Morton 24. Ricky Steamboat 25. Riki Choshu 26. Ron Garvin 27. Sangre Chicana 28. Shinya Hashimoto 29. Stan Hansen 30. Tatsumi Fujinami 31. Terry Funk 32. Toshiaki Kawada 33. Tully Blanchard 34. William Regal 35. Yoshiaki Fujiwara 36. Yuki Ishikawa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DR Ackermann Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 You can throw Casas on that list too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DylanZero Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Slam Dunks: Negro Casas Jumbo Tsuruta Jerry Lawler Genichiro Tenryu Nick Bockwinkel Ric Flair Mitsuharu Misawa Kenta Kobashi Terry Funk Satanico Toshiaki Kawada Santito Blue Panther Tatsumi Fujinami Billy Robinson El Dandy Ricky Steamboat Atlantis Bobby Eaton Ricky Morton Buddy Rose Rey Misterio Jr. Rick Martel Jun Akiyama Koji Kanemoto Jushin Liger Shinjiro Otani Hiroshi Hase Eddie Guerrero Vader Akira Hokuto Akira Maeda Volk Han Riki Choshu Manami Toyota Eric Embry KENTA 37 with people either I'm already considering for top 20 or a few that will be on the lower end of my list that meant too much for me personally at the time I started watching them and after for me NOT to find a spot for them on my list. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shining Wiz Posted October 7, 2014 Report Share Posted October 7, 2014 Slam dunks: Ricky Steamboat ric Flair, flop and all Vader John Cena Bobby Eaton Daniel Bryan Danielson Mitsahru Misawa Stan Hansen Terry Funk Mick Foley Kenta Kobashi Cesaro KENTA Clear blind spot on lucha. Those are my only real definite off the top of my head right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted October 8, 2014 Report Share Posted October 8, 2014 Slam dunks as of today: AJ Styles Andre the Giant Arn Anderson Chris Benoit CM Punk Daniel Bryan Eddie Guerrero Jerry Lawler Jim Breaks John Cena Mark Henry Rey Mysterio Ric Flair Shawn Michaels Stan Hansen Steve Austin The Destroyer 17 names. Sounds about right given my blind spots include almost all of lucha, puro, joshi, indies, territories, Europe, the 90s, the 70s and anything prior to that. But I can't envision any of those guys falling completely off. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Sleeze Posted October 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted October 9, 2014 Thanks to Wrestling Culture #50, already had a template. Basically the only movement has been due to 00s Japan. Akiyama makes the list. Tenryu and Kobashi are the huge winners. 1. Ric Flair - The Man, sheer volume 2. Stan Hansen - Inching closer and closer 3. Mtsuharu Misawa - Best comeback 4. Toshiaki Kawada - Best knee selling 5. Kenta Kobashi - GHC Title Reign Takes Him To Top 5 (Great Underdog and Champion, a complete story) 6. Rey Misterio Jr. - Perfect Integration of Lucha & American wrestling 7. Jumbo Tsuruta - Mr. All Japan 8. Genichiro Tenryu - King Prick 9. Jushin Liger - Best Japanese Junior 10. Vader - Best big man ever 11. Eddie Guerrero - Most Entertaining Wrestler 12. Terry Funk - Ultimate Main Event Utility Player 13. Randy Savage - Intensity, credibility, ruthless 14. Barry Windham - Best ring movement 15. Bobby Eaton - Best punch 16. Ricky Morton - FIP 17. Arn Anderson - Best midcarder ever? 18. Greg Valentine - Best WWF Bellhop (Could carry anyone). 19. Shawn Michaels - Rockers run & 90s singles >>>>>>>> 00s comeback 20. Akira Taue - 1995 & 2005 21. Nick Bockwinkel - Thinking man's wrestler 22. Ricky Steamboat - What is about "Ricky's" and selling? 23. John Cena - Best wrestler of 00s 24. Shinya Hashimoto - Best Strong Style 25. Bret Hart - Best offensive moveset of North America 26. Jun Akiyama - White or Blue, he is still cool 27. Dr. Death - 1994 28. Steve Austin - Best Attitude Era Worker 29. Bob Backlund - God of Headlocks 30. Daniel Bryan - Sky is the limit...well you know... (wrote that before the injury, for me as a viewer it still is because I have seen so little of his indy work) 31. Chris Benoit - Separation of art and the man 32. Dustin Rhodes/Goldust - Saga continues... 33. Tito Santana - Blood feud worker 34. Rick Martel - Most consistent wrestler 35. Lex Luger - Best bodybuilder wrestler 36. Hulk Hogan - Most underrated 37. Brian Pillman - What could have been? 38. AJ Styles - Air, Land and Sea 39. Yoshinari Ogawa - My Spirit Wrestler 40. William Regal - Ring General 41. Ronnie Garvin - OW! 42. Yoshihiro Takayama - Bleach Blond & Badddddddd 43. Owen Hart - Best Younger Brother Brat 44. Curt Hennig - AWA salvages Mr. Perfect 45. Kerry Von Erich - Flair/Jumbo, need to see more 46. Jerry Lawler - Separation of the wrestler and the commentator 47. Yuki Ishikawa - Crazy hair, crazier punches 48. Kensuke Sasaki - POWER WOYAH (So that's his worst run, but the name is very apt) 49. Marty Jannetty - Rockers 50. Sean Waltman - Best Underdog Story...until now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 70s guys - even though my explorations are not yet complete, I have a good sense all of these guys will make it based on what I've seen and what I likeDory Funk Jr - in too many good to great matches to ignore, makes up for ostensible lack of charisma with superb counter wrestling, solid psychology, occasionally intricate limb work, and more bombs than you might imagine, probably a top 40 finishJack Brisco - sort of guy who comes along only once in a generation, not even seen a quarter of the stuff yet but clearly one of the best workers in the world in his day, complete wrestler, probable top 20 finish. Prototype for every prominent NWA-type babyface of the 80s, but arguably more talented than any of them.Harley Race - will definitely rank, question is how high. Lots more to go, sometimes I love him, but he has a lot of habits I find frustrating.Billy Robinson - brilliant worker, among the best mat wrestlers of all time, but also mixes in high artillery offense and bumps with the best of them. Want to see everything I can, but should finish top half.Giant Baba - like Dory, in too many good to great matches to ignore, unique wrestler and contender for "smartest" worker ever. Have loved some of his 70s singles matches with Race. Top half finish for sure.The Sheik - I seem to like him more than 99% of other people. Performances in those Funks tags are world class, and I dug the hell out of the Steamboat match from All Japan. Quite a bit of 70s Sheik out there to explore. I should be able to find room for him -- possibly I'll be his only vote, who knows.NWA /WCW guysRic Flair - nuff said, will be #1 or #2 when all is said and done.Arn Anderson - lock top 30. Love the guy.Lex Luger - will almost certainly rank because I have really loved him 87-91 and I already know I like him more than most in the rest of the 90s.Tully Blanchard - another lock. Hurt a little bit by longevity, but more great singles matches to his name than Arn. Might seek out some more pre-Crockett stuff from South West, there is quite a bit out there.Ron Garvin - will definitely rank, but how high I'm not sure yet. Love the Flair matches. Will seek out his stuff for Poffo in time. And need to see his Memphis stuff.Wahoo McDaniel - I love hard-hitting wrestlers. I want to rank Wahoo and he'll probably be in the 80-100 range. Would like to see more of him in the 70s. I also love Flair name-checking him in every promo ever.Ole Anderson - As with Wahoo, love his stiffness and surliness. Tremendous promo, arguably top 5 of all-time. Wish there was more 70s Ole available. Probable 80-100 guy.Ricky Steamboat - I'm higher on him than a lot of people. Everything a babyface should be. Think he's a victim of people trying to be trendy. I've watched the Flair trilogy in recent memory and they remain phenomenal. Great tagging with Youngblood with a fantastic performance at MSG against shitty Bulldog Brower. Great at selling, stiff strikes, good execution on his bombs -- possibly let down occasionally by some boring matwork, disappointing in Japan. Likely top 20 for me though, I like him that much.Bobby Eaton - Tremendous worker and star on any variant of the Midnights, never quite puts it together as a singles, but he's so good in so many matches that I don't care. Want him to place as high as possible. Love his offensive bombs, but great at punching, selling, timing and basically everything. His performance in the match against Bill Watts and Stagger Lee is something else.Ricky Morton - Lower on him than a lot of people because I want more to a guy than just ability to bump and sell, but he'll definitely rank somewhere.Barry Windham - Likely in 80-100 range, I'm lower on him than most, but he's too good not to place somewhere. LOVE his float over suplex.Ivan Koloff - Carried that Russians team and did a superb job of transitioning to working a different style in his later years. Genuinely very good in the squashes and stuff I saw from early 80s GCW, one of Bruno's better opponents in the 70s. I want to see more of what is available from Florida and elsewhere -- and there is some on tape which I have here. Underrated as a worker I think and should rank.Rick Rude - Rude in 92 is one of my all-time favourite guys and I will have to find a place for him somewhere, even if I think he sucked before 89 and his peak was pretty short. I couldn't love Rude with the short hair and mustache in WCW more if I tried. Possibly only Jesse Ventura loved him more.Vader - hard not to love his brutality, need to see more of him in NJPW, a lot of great performances, likely top 40.Eddie Guerrero - I haven't talked about the late 90s much, but I thought Eddie was fantastic in WCW and really liked him right till the very end even after he bulked up. A lot of superb matches. I remember thinking the Rey feud over the son and all that was great, just compelling TV and one of the last great things I can recall before I called time on watching modern WWE. I need to revisit him a bit to make a call on where he'll finish.Chris Benoit - I think he had too many good performances not to rank somewhere, even if I was always lower on him than most of the rest of the internet. I always preferred Eddie because he had better charisma, crowd control, and psychology, but Benoit was a suplex machine, and I love me some suplexes.Mid-South guysTed DiBiase - my personal favourite wrestler from when I was a kid and think he's good at basically everything: selling, bumping, offense, punching and brawling, controlling a crowd, controlling the pace of a match, timing, just superb. Complete all-rounder. His peak is in Mid-South but his early career as a firey babyface is underrated, and I still have a soft spot for the Million Dollar Man that everyone knows about. I include 1988 in his peak. Will place as high as I can justify, which likely means top 25.Dick Murdoch - just to appease Will. No really, I have really liked the Mid-South stuff of Murdoch's I've seen, and especially like him as a heel. I wasn't that enamored with his later work in WCW. Have seen bits and bobs from St. Louis and elsewhere in the 70s. Need to see more of him in New Japan. Thought his matches in AJPW in 1980 were a bit exhibtion-y and boring. He will rank though for sure.Butch Reed - probably will be in 90-100 range but I think he looks fantastic circa 83-4, and really liked some of the Doom matches in 1990. I like POWER wrestlers and Reed both looked the part and did some sweet offense, while having better psychology than your typical Steiner brother.WWF guysAndre - will find space for him. Too good at what he did for too long to ignore. Great timing, and great at working "as a giant". Not as high as Matt D on his late 80s heel stuff, but he was better than the Scott Keiths made out too. I can't understand how some people think Bam Bam Bigelow was a better worker than Andre.Bob Backlund - I know I said he wouldn't make the 100, but thinking about it, he almost certainly will despite all my many reservations. Too many good to great matches to ignore. One of the most frustrating wrestlers ever for me. Arguably the best piledriver in the business.Hulk Hogan - don't know how he can't rank, one of the best ever babyfaces at generating sympathy from a heat segment, crowd control is excellent, connection with crowds off the charts. Performances in AWA and New Japan add to the legend. Really great circa 84-5, but can still turn it on when he wants to after that. Don't understand how he won't be making so many people's lists.Bruno Sammartino - in terms of connecting with a crowd, he has no peer. Tremendous fire, a unique rough and tumble style, can work the mat on occasion, one of the best comebacks the business has ever seen, and like Hogan one of the very best at generating sympathy. I think both Bruno and Hogan are better "working babyfaces" than, say, Dusty Rhodes, who relied so much on his promos and / or getting bloodied. I genuinely prefer them both to Backlund too. Wrestling is not just about headlocks, it's also about crowd control.Randy Savage - should finish pretty high, best working champion they had for 20+ years. Charisma off the charts. More great matches than anyone in that promotion for a long time. Good at many many things and consistently excellent for his entire run up to 92-3. Also has some good stuff in WCW. Need to see him in Memphis and ICW.Bret Hart - people probably think I'm down on Bret but I'm not, but I just think his advocates vastly overrate him and that it's absurd to think of him as a #1 contender. But he was one of the very best during his time on top, notwithstanding criticisms of his house show performances. He'll be on my list somewhere, Shawn Michaels likely won't be.Steve Austin - I don't really have a rep as someone who likes the Attitude Era, but Austin had too many great performances to ignore, and I'm not exactly in a hurry to revisit. But he'll be on my list somewhere too.Kurt Angle - I like suplexes and I thought Angle was legimately great before he lost his hair and started wearing a gum shield. Couldn't care less about his TNA run, and much, much preferred him as the goofy "Three Is" "It's True" heel, but he was too good at doing suplexes for me to leave off my 100. PWO probably goes too far in it's anti-Angle sentiment, even if it is "true" that he became very go go go. Need to revisit a bit to decide where he'll fall.80s AJPW guysTerry Funk - could really be listed anywhere, but here seems right. Top 5 most likely. Has been impossible to ignore while investigating Dory Jr too, legitimately great.Stan Hansen - outside shot at #1 depending on just how great the 90s stuff is. Love his stiffness.Jumbo Tsuruta - only real contender for Flair's #1 spot right now, but time is running out. A lot riding on performances in 90-1 for him. Really love him, seemingly more than most.Generico Tenryu - need to see more of him in the 90s. In the 80s, I didn't like him as a face and thought he was the clear 4th best guy in a lot of the high-end tags. Only really comes into his own circa 88-89, when he becomes the moody ass-kicking leader of Revolution. Potential top 10 depending on what else there is in the 90s. Based on 80s though, more like top 30.Yoshiaki Yatsu - tremendous offensive wrestler who worked his arse off bumping and selling at 100-miles an hour in so many of those mid-80s tags. We have been seeing him in 1981 as a youngster working WWF for Titans recently, and he is one of the better workers on that roster. Need to see him in New Japan. Seemingly falls off a cliff in 90, but we have a whole decade of stuff before that.AWA guysNick Bockwinkel - top 10 most likely. Complete wrestler. Possibly the most complete wrestler ever.Jerry Blackwell - I really like him bouncing off those cages. Will try to find space in the 80-100 range, which is going to be my home for a lot of guys I have generally warm feelings about.Rick Martel - phenomenal babyface, think he's been great in 80-81 WWF, and a lot of good performances in the AWA. One of the very best comebacks in the business. Great sense of fire and energy in everything he does. Will potentially finish above Ricky Steamboat. The embodiment of everything I think a babyface should be. Jack Brisco will do well to finish above Martel -- even if Brisco fathered the style that Martel mastered. He was pretty sexy too.Bobby Heenan - need to watch more of him in the 70s, but really great bumper and bleeder. Good shot at being my benchmark #100.Sgt. Slaughter - could have listed him for Crockett or WWF, doesn't really matter, the guy was really excellent from 1980 to 1985 and I think his WWF run in 1991 is underrated for how much he worked his arse off. Short peak, but a lot of great performances and a very solid "greatest hits" package of great matches everywhere he worked. Only thing is, I thought his matches with Hansen were a wee bit disappointing. Heat was off-the-charts during his heel run in early 80s WWF.OthersMr Saito - love the guy whether stooging in the AWA vs. Hogan / tagging with Fuji, dropping massive bombs as an asskicker, or working an amateur mat-based style. Saito could do it all.Kerry Von Erich - great babyface involved in a lot of good to great matches and I've not even watched him in Texas.Michael Hayes - if I can find room for him, I will. Great at crowd control. Off-the-charts charisma. Underrated worker. Good punch. Consummate cowardly heel when he wants to be. Singles run in 89 WCW undersold.Lou Thesz - need to watch more of that Chicago stuff, but Thesz was masterful in that Verne match, and his character work a legit surprise to me.Areas for further investigation:Buddy Rose - too much has been pimped to ignore, was great tagging with Somers in AWA.80s NJPW - the key name here is Fujinami to me. He has been great from 80-1. But am also eager to see Choshu and co before jumping.90s AJPW - doing the podcast with Steven, and am more excited about it than anything else right now. Just knowing what I like and from what I've seen already, you might as well reserve three spots in my top 10 and a fourth spot somewhere in my top 20 right now. I don't want to say that none of them have a shot at #1, but they are going to have to do a hell of a lot to finish ahead of Flair or Jumbo at this point.00s Japan - the main priority is Akiyama who is a total blind spot for me. Don't think I've ever seen a match of his. I may take a cursory glance at modern New Japan too, but it is not high priority.Puerto Rico - dipped my toe in watching Dory Jr, and need to see those pimped Colon and Invader matches, and anything involving Hansen or Terry FunkMemphis - need to finish off 80s set. Dundee will certainly rank, as will Lawler, even though I'm not nearly as high on him as a lot of people are. I want more than punches, great timing and selling most of the time.Lucha - continue to struggle to get into it, and it may well never be my thing. Will get back to 80s Lucha set at some point. Trios matches continue to bewilder me. The matwork leaves me cold. The wilder brawls have been the best and easiest things to get into. I don't want to write Lucha off though, too many people whose opinions I respect think too highly of it.WoS - it's been the start of the new academic year, so been a bit pressed for time, but this is high priority and next on the "to do" list. I appreciate the work OJ puts into this.Modern WWE - I will look at Bryan, Punk, Rey, and Cena, and take a look at what Regal has been up to. I have a strong "style bias" against modern WWE main event style, and continue to basically hate the presentation, even though it is not as bad as it used to be."Indie shit" - in particular AJ Styles and Daniel Bryan. Low Ki is actually growing on me. I have a strong "style bias" against the presentational aspects of 00s Indie, but the work has actually surprised me in how good it has been in terms of psychology and matwork. It has admittedly made me re-evaluate some of my preconceptions of the style.Joshi - will watch the stuff Loss recommends. Can see a couple of them making my list. ECW - very low priority, but will likely want to check out some 2 Cold Scorpio, because I like his WCW stuff, and want to revisit some of the Terry Funk stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elliott Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 70s guys - even though my explorations are not yet complete, I have a good sense all of these guys will make it based on what I've seen and what I like Dory Funk Jr - in too many good to great matches to ignore, makes up for ostensible lack of charisma with superb counter wrestling, solid psychology, occasionally intricate limb work, and more bombs than you might imagine, probably a top 40 finish Giant Baba - like Dory, in too many good to great matches to ignore, unique wrestler and contender for "smartest" worker ever. Have loved some of his 70s singles matches with Race. Top half finish for sure. Hey Parv, you may have talked about it somewhere already and if so sorry for asking, but have you watched the Destroyer vs GIant Baba 60 minute draw from 1969 yet? Based on your remarks about Baba and the "superb counter wrestling....intricate limb work" part of the Dory section, I feel like that match would be right up your alley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exposer Posted October 10, 2014 Report Share Posted October 10, 2014 Ah hell, I might as well do what Parv did and break it down similarly. 70s - This is a priority. I haven't seen any of the 70s classics minus the Funks-Abby/Sheik feud and Buddy Rose stuff. 80s JCP - I have seen the 89 stuff. Everything else is a priority. I've got to watch that stuff. I have seen some of the Flair classics, but there's too much other big stuff out there. Candidates (Flair, Arn, Tully, Windham, Garvin, Eaton, Morton, Rogers, Luger, Wahoo, there's plenty of others, but I'm lazy right now) WWF - I have seen a ton of 84-89. Pre-84 is what I need to see. Candidates (Hogan, Piper, Orndorff, Savage, Steamboat, Valentine, Santana, etc.) AJPW - Sort of been working on that lately. I've have a little bit to go on that. Candidates (Jumbo, Tenryu, Yatsu, Hansen, Funk, etc.) NJPW - I have a lot to go here. I've seen the classics (gauntlets, elimination tags, etc.). Candidates (Fujinami, Choshu, Fujiwara, etc.) Memphis - Another dead spot. I've seen a few of the Lawler classics. Candidates (Lawler, Dundee, Mantel, etc.) Puerto Rico - I've seen a lot of it. There's a few things I still need to see. Candidates (Colon, Invader I, etc.) Portland - I've seen a ton of it involving Buddy up to 85. The rest is pretty bad with the exception of a few things I here. Candidates (Buddy, Wiskowski) Mid-South - Total novice. I'm not sure I've ever seen a Mid-South match in my life. I know it's awful. Candidates (This will have names in them one day or I've failed) World Class - I've seen the classics. There's probably a few more things I need to see. Candidates (Kerry, Kevin, Gordy, Hayes, etc.) Lucha - I have the set. Should finish it before the next 18 months. Candidates (Chicana, Cota, Santo, Villano III, Atlantis, Satanico, etc.) AWA - Watched it all. Great stuff. Candidates (Bock, Hennig, Blackwell, Slaughter, Saito, Jannetty, Michaels, etc.) Joshi - I've seen that Dump-Chigasu match before. Maybe. Candidates (This will have names one day as well) Europe - Worse than Mid-South. Candidates (This must have names) Georgia/Florida/Southwest/Southeast/St. Louis - Maybe a few matches, but other than that I'm new to it all. (I won't leave you out either other territories) 90s WWF - I've seen a shit ton of it. There's probably a few things I need to see. Candidates (Bret, Owen, Austin, etc.) WCW - There's probably nothing I need to see. I might re-watch some things though. Candidates (Vader, Pillman, Regal, Finlay, Benoit, Eddie, etc.) ECW - I've seen some of the pimped stuff. There's a few things I'd still like to see. Candidates (2 Cold Scorpio) SMW - I have seen some of it. Kind of the same boat as ECW. (A lot of the same guys from elsewhere, maybe I'll add a name or too) AJPW - I've seen a lot of the classics. There's still a few I need to see. (Misawa, Kawada, Kobashi, Taue, Akiyama, Kikuchi, Fuchi, etc.) NJPW - I need to get on this. (Hash, Hase, Muto, etc.) Joshi - I've seen a few of the classics. There's still a lot I need to see. (Aja, Bull, Hokuto, etc.) Puerto Rico - I here there's some hidden gems here. Probably worth checking out. (Not sure yet) Lucha - I've seen some 90s lucha. There's still a lot out there for me to see. (Dandy, Casas, Panther, etc.) Other stuff - I like shootstyle so I should check that stuff out. There might be some good indies stuff too. (This will have to wait and see) 2000s WWF/E - Been there done that. Of course, I'll probably re-watch a few things to refresh my memory. (Rey, Cena, Bryan, Punk, Christian, etc.) TNA - I've seen the few matches that I feel I need to watch. The rest would be for specific workers only. (Styles, Joe, Aries, etc.) Indies - Recently, I've seen a lot. Peak ROH, IWA-MS? I have a long road to go. (Don't no yet) Lucha - In the last few years, I'm golden. Earlier parts of the decade I need to check out. (Virus, maybe others) Japan - Same as lucha. (Maybe, but I don't know yet) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBadMick Posted October 12, 2014 Report Share Posted October 12, 2014 'Mid-South - Total novice. I'm not sure I've ever seen a Mid-South match in my life. I know it's awful' Actually, Mid-South's rather good.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodhelmet Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 These are my working Top 20 (not in order). As much as I want some sleeper guys to go higher, not going to happen. 1. Jerry Lawler 2. Bill Dundee 3. Buddy Rose 4. Daniel Bryan 5. Dick Murdoch 6. El Dandy 7. El Hijo Del Santo 8. Genichiro Tenryu 9. Jumbo Tsuruta 10. Jushin Liger 11. Kenta Kobashi 12. Mitsuharu Misawa 13. Negro Casas 14. Nick Bockwinkel 15. Rey Mysterio Jr. 16. Ric Flair 17. Stan Hansen 18. Steven Regal 19. Tatsumi Fujinami 20. Toshiaki Kawada Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NintendoLogic Posted October 13, 2014 Report Share Posted October 13, 2014 I decided to list everybody off the top of my head who who was more likely than not to finish in the top half of my ballot and came up with 34 names. Aja KongAkira TaueBarry WindhamBilly RobinsonBret HartBryan DanielsonChris BenoitDevil MasamiEddy GuerreroEl DandyEl Hijo del SantoGenichiro TenryuJerry LawlerJumbo TsurutaJun AkiyamaJushin LigerKenta KobashiMitsuharu MisawaNegro CasasNick BockwinkelRey MysterioRic FlairRicky SteamboatRiki ChoshuSatanicoShawn MichaelsShinya HashimotoStan HansenSteve AustinTatsumi FujinamiTerry FunkToshiaki KawadaVaderVolk Han Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El McKell Posted October 21, 2014 Report Share Posted October 21, 2014 I put together a list of around 100 possible top 100 contenders in no perticular order about 2 weeks ago before i started actually watching anything for this project. Figured I may as well post this here, in large part for myself so i can easily look on here and see who drops off this by the time I've watched stuff from all the nominees Kenta Kobashi Misawa Kawada Dr. Death Vader Jumbo Hansen Jun Akiyama Taue CM Punk Edge Cena Jeff Hardy Daniel Bryan HHH Jericho Benoit Christian Eddie Guerrero Angle AJ Styles Samoa Joe KENTA Hero Kyle O'Reilly Michael Elgin Davey Richards Sami Zayn Ricochet Tozawa Shingo Masaaki Mohcuzuki Chris Daniels Dynamite Kid William Regal Tanahashi Nakamura Shibata Nagata Minoru Suzuki Okada Ibushi Devitt Low-Ki Steen Austin Aries Claudio Castignoli Flair Steamboat Ted DiBiase Terry Funk Dory Funk Curt Hennig Arn Anderson Tully Blanchard Brian Pillman Austin Foley Mysterio jr Psichosis Johnny Saint Tiger Mask 1 La Parka Jerry Estrada Negro Casas El Hijo Del Santo Jushin Liger Great Sasuke Koji Kanemoto TAKA El Samurai Jinsei Shinsaki Randy Savage Scott Steiner Bret Hart Owen Hart Bobby Eaton Stan Lane HBK Seth Rollins Hulk Hogan The Rock Brock Lesnar Lioness Asuka Chigusa Nagayo Dynamite Kansai Toshiyo Yamada AJA Kong Manami Toyota Mayumi Osaki Akira Hokuto Kyoko Inoue Juventud Natsuki*Taiyo Mutoh Hashimoto Riki Chosu Kensuke Fujinami Ultimo Dragon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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