concrete1992 Posted May 3, 2016 Report Share Posted May 3, 2016 What... ... ... What is art? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El-P Posted May 3, 2016 Report Share Posted May 3, 2016 So the takeaway from this is that wrestling isn't all that diverse after all? And because it's not that diverse we should respect all styles equally? I just want to ensure I have the central thesis right. It's not a matter of "respecting" all style. If you really get bored shitless by shoot-style, which I can understand, I don't see why you should try to watch it, even for GWE purpose. I've been watching pro-wrestling for 25 years. I never got into pure lucha. Not too sure why. Never tried that hard. Never was truly drawn to it either. Also, yeah, at some point, I never could quite figure out what was happening in those trios matches, which I found formulaic, devoid of excitement. Maybe, probably, it's just me not getting the way they work. Maybe it's the cultural gap. Probably not considering how many people not from Mexico love it. Maybe it's just that I really never cared for the style, whereas shoot-style came more naturally because it was closer in form to what I was interested in : japanese guys pretending to fight in martial arts tournaments. Blame Saint Seya & Dragon Ball watch when I was 11. Never liked the lucha announcing, much like the match I thought it was an annoying background sound. Maybe because it sounded like soccer announcing to me, not speaking spanish one bit. I don't give a shit about soccer. Japanese announcing never bothered me as a background sound, I found it charming although I didn't understand anything. Me being interested in Japan much more than Mexico (or hispanic culture as a whole) ?. Maybe. Probably. But in essence, I'm pretty sure if I watched enough, I could rank guys fairly. Like the famous quote said, "X luchador doesn't do anything that the old grandma at ringside can't understand". It's not rocket-science. it's not philosophy not free-jazz, nor serial music. It's too guys pretending to fight, one is the bad guy, one is the good guy. At the end, one wins. Not sure where I'm going, but… well, basically, pro-wrestling is mostly the same thing everywhere. The form changes a bit, so does the presentation, but I don't think there are some grandstandings to make about great cultural differences that would make a style totally impossible to get. Unlike, for instance, try to differenciate Turkish folk and Turkish classical music if you're totally unfamiliar. Or the dozens different romani dance musics that a gypsy orchestra from Eastern Istanbul can play. Pro-wrestling is basic stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted May 3, 2016 Report Share Posted May 3, 2016 As a small and hopefully amusing aside, I went on a date two years ago in which I said "do you hear that swooshing noise coming from down there? I believe that is called dubstep". This woman found that hilarious and next time I saw her had made a full dubstep compilation CD adorned with artwork she'd drawn herself and covered with various quotes from stuff I'd said on that date. Was a pretty sweet, if also quite weird, gesture. But it did increase my knowledge of dubstep significantly. I didn't see her again. When I get home I might upload a pic of that CD, cos it remains one of the most remarkable things I have in my possession. But you swear you're not a heel? SMH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted May 3, 2016 Report Share Posted May 3, 2016 Someone wanted to see it: The black guy is because I told her about my childhood rating system. 1 point for moustache, 1 point for beard, 1 point for white hair, 1 point for glasses and 1 point for being black. If there was ever a game show, I'd root for anyone who had the most points. My love of Arn and Ted and Rude actually all derive from that point system. Mr. T did very well too! Ha ha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...TG Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 Someone wanted to see it: The black guy is because I told her about my childhood rating system. 1 point for moustache, 1 point for beard, 1 point for white hair, 1 point for glasses and 1 point for being black. If there was ever a game show, I'd root for anyone who had the most points. My love of Arn and Ted and Rude actually all derive from that point system. Mr. T did very well too! Ha ha. You shoud have married this lady. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benbeeach Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 I just don't understand or adhere to the idea that one of the three biggest markets of wrestling there is, is somehow obscure. I don't think anyone is making the argument that the 44th best King of the Deathmatch worker you've ever seen deserves a spot on everyone's list. The 44th DIY punk band that never made it out of Portland probably doesn't need much consideration. The best luchadors of all time, are some of the best wrestlers of all time, period, where we're engaging (engaged) in the making of a list, of the best wrestlers of all time. It's not asinine to think they deserve consideration. If you can make the argument that Andrew "Test" Martin (I doubt he even received a vote, random example, very decent wrestler) is better than Blue Panther in your mind, I'd listen, and you should rank accordingly. But if you can't then maybe you shouldn't. You still can, you still could, you still did, but maybe you shouldn't have. MaybeI know no one's going to be able to watch everything, I sure as hell can't anymore, and not everything is for everybody, but the best always has a way of rising. If shoot style bores you, fine. Doesn't make it inherently boring, or hard to understand. Didn't mean it wasn't great. I think the best Fujiwara match in any setting is easy to digest and understand and enjoy. I think the worst Takada match will set you back some, but his best match won't. What is valuable > What you personally value. But a list made of the latter, isn't always going to have an equal representation of the former. It can't. There is no master list which is the undeniable right, and truth. Is what it is, especially at this point. Hope this exercise has opened up more people's eyes to more things. I think it has.There is something to the "weight of GWE" or whatever Parv called it, where discovering a wrestler under these circumstances makes it incredibly hard and taxing when you then have to rank where they list in the entirety of modern wrestling annals after having only seen 8 matches or something. But if you chose to undertake a great task then... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElHijodeGorgeousGeorge Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 I just don't get this "don't vote with your biases" argument. Literally anything that you do in life has a bias attached to it, and that's just human nature. Wrestling is beautiful because it is actually INCREDIBLY diverse. That's not saying that there aren't obvious metrics to think of when ranking such but it does say that at the end of the day, I would say the vast majority of the ballots were filled to the brim with favoritism. That is ok, also. I know that mine was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luchaundead Posted May 4, 2016 Report Share Posted May 4, 2016 As a small and hopefully amusing aside, I went on a date two years ago in which I said "do you hear that swooshing noise coming from down there? I believe that is called dubstep". This woman found that hilarious and next time I saw her had made a full dubstep compilation CD adorned with artwork she'd drawn herself and covered with various quotes from stuff I'd said on that date. Was a pretty sweet, if also quite weird, gesture. But it did increase my knowledge of dubstep significantly. I didn't see her again. When I get home I might upload a pic of that CD, cos it remains one of the most remarkable things I have in my possession. But you swear you're not a heel? SMH Yeah why the hell did you not see her again? That's a pretty cool thing for a person to do after 1 date. I'll give you that her taste is music isn't great but really how much time in adult relationships do you really spend listening to music together? I was even going to attack her for her choice of Dub Step as a lot of those songs I would not classify that way but she saves it with "Dubstep derived" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 It's a story that is probably not appropriate for The Military Industrial Suplex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Sorrow Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 That's code for "she wouldn't take it in the dumper". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted May 5, 2016 Report Share Posted May 5, 2016 I can tell you on the next Titans, Johnny. It's a more fitting environent! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gutenberger Posted May 9, 2016 Report Share Posted May 9, 2016 Sounds more crazy than cool to me. . . A little overboarding on the gift side. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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