Most Important Matches in History

[JerryvonKramer]

I don't know the ins and outs, I just know that people on the street can name Big Daddy vs. Giant Haystacks, but they can't name most other wrestlers from the era.

 

Also worth noting that they weren't just name checked on those TV shows, they might have guest spots. Whatever the reality of the numbers, etc., the perception is that it was the biggest match. Similar to how someone like Geoff Capes might not actually be the strongest man in the world, but was certainly the most famous strongman in Britain, etc.

[cheapshot]

It was the peak of British Wrestling from an audience standpoint. Yes, it wasn't in the BARB's top 10 shows for 1981 (lowest being 17.6 million), so there's no way to "prove" the rating, bar what ITV told people at the time.

 

1962 was reported to be around 16 million, which again is hard to prove.

 

We're not dealing in hard data, which is a shame. Remember the Big Daddy vs. Haystacks play that was popular in the 00s - It wasn't like they were doing a Jackie Pallo vs. Tommy Lorne play instead.

 

Sting vs. Hogan at Starrcade 1997 was massively important, regardless of the massive slide thereafter.

[JerryvonKramer]

Here's a pretty good example, It's Giant Haystacks on They Think It's All Over, which was a sports-themed comedy show that went out in the late 90s:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9-kgnTNKh8

 

Gary Lineker (football star, tv personality, current host of MOTD) worked out that it was Haystacks after a minute or so. I guarantee you that he couldn't have done that with any other wrestler other than Big Daddy himself.

[Al]

For women, Moolah/Richter on MTV is probably as important as anything besides Burke/Byer.

 

By that standpoint, I would look at any matches that aired live nationally in the '80s. Hogan/Andre at Main Event, Hogan/Piper before Wrestlemania. We take for granted how rare it was at one point to see live wrestling on national television.

[BrianB]

On the Hogan-Andre tip, while not at the audience or buy level of WM3 or The Main Event, the Survivor Series 1987 match was very important from a historical perspective. It was their first match since Wrestlemania 3, helped build The Main Event match, and that was the PPV where Vince undercut JCP and Starrcade to where JCP couldn't make the balloon payments JCP promised talents, which ultimately contributed to them going out of business the next year.

[peachchaos]

Perhaps the build is more memorable, but the WM14 main event with Mike Tyson, D-X, Shawn's last match for four years and Austin winning the WWF Championship for the first time has to be on the list.

[elliott]

For women, Moolah/Richter on MTV is probably as important as anything besides Burke/Byer.

 

By that standpoint, I would look at any matches that aired live nationally in the '80s. Hogan/Andre at Main Event, Hogan/Piper before Wrestlemania. We take for granted how rare it was at one point to see live wrestling on national television.

 

The Moolah vs Richter pick is actually a good one that I never would have remembered. When I thought to myself "What about women's matches" the thought started with "Well, no Moolah matches, ok what else..."

 

Agree on your 2nd point as well. Something like Rogers vs O'Connor was really elevated in importance in my eyes when I learned it was the first ever closed circuit event.

 

Did anyone mention Hogan vs Iron Sheik while we're thinking about expansion era WWF?

[elliott]

I'm still hoping El Boricua comes in and tells us which Abby vs Colon match is the most important. Same with Khawk and AWA. Hey Grimmas, what about that whole Canada thing? Montreal was an enormous wrestling city for decades. Surely something important happened in Canada at some point other than Survivor Series 97. Asking about everywhere else first? That's what you call Canadian Patriotism.

 

In the meantime, for some reason I feel compelled to ruin the thread by pointing out that only 3 Flair matches have been named: vs Kerry 12/25/82, Starrcade 83 Main Event, and vs Sting from Clash 1. That actually feels about right in terms of Flair matches. Are we missing anything obvious? Its not really a "Flair match" even though he's in it, but what about the first War Games?

[Ricky Jackson]

I've heard that Thesz over Rogers for the NWA strap in Toronto in 63 led to something big

[Johnny Sorrow]

Of course the match that's the start of the Freebirds vs Von Erichs fued is important. It jumped started a dead territory into both an attempt at going worldwide and major recognition, and fans remember it.

[elliott]

What are the 5 biggest/most important Giant Baba matches? If I had to guess it would be something like:

Giant Baba vs Fritz Von Erich 12/03/66 - Main event of the first ever wrestling show at Budokan Hall

Giant Baba vs Gene Kiniski 08/14/67 - NWA International Champ vs NWA Champ in front of 25,000 in Osaka. 65minute draw, Baba said it was his greatest match.

Giant Baba vs The Destroyer 12/19/72 - Baba beats Destroyer with the stipulation that if Destroyer loses he commits to All Japan full time as and becomes Baba's tag partner. Instrumental in solidifying All Japan in the early days.

Giant Baba vs Jack Brisco 12/2/74 - Baba wins NWA title for the first time.

Giant Baba & Antonio Inoki vs Tiger Jeet Singh & Abdullah the Butcher 08/26/79 - Two biggest stars team up for the first time since December 1971 and for the last time against the top foreign monster heels on a rare joint show during the Japanese wrestling war.

 

Does that seem right? I feel pretty good about the first 4. The last one I could be talked out of in favor of one of the following (or something else entirely):

 

Giant Baba & Antonio Inoki vs Bill Watts & Tarzan Tyler 10/31/67 - Baba & Inoki win NWA International Tag Team Titles for first time

Giant Baba vs Bruno Sammartino 05/09/75 - PWF Title vs WWWF Title 60 minute draw

 

Am I missing anything obvious or not obvious?

[elliott]

For the list lovers/OCD crowd, here's everything mentioned so far.

 

Old School US/Canada

1. Frank Gotch beats George Hackenschmidt 4/3/1908
2. Joe Stecher vs Ed Lewis 07/04/1916 Omaha 5 hr Draw
3. Jim Londos vs Dick Shikat 06/06/1930
4. Ed Lewis vs Henri Deglane 05/04/31
5. Jim Londos vs Ed Lewis 09/20/1934
6. Danno O'Mahoney vs Ed Don George
7. Danno O'Mahoney vs Dick Shikat 3/21/1936
8. Lou Thesz vs Baron Michele Leone 05/21/52
9. Buddy Rogers vs Pat O’Connor 06/30/61
10. Bruno Sammartino vs Buddy Rogers 05/17/63
11. Lou Thesz vs Buddy Rogers Toronto 63
12. Bruno vs Koloff 01/18/71
13. Verne Gagne vs Nick Bockwinkel 11/75
14. Bruno Sammartino vs Superstar Billy Graham 04/30/77

 

Modern US/Canada

1. Larry Zbyszko vs Bruno Sammartino at Shea - 8/9/80

2. Ric Flair vs Kerry von Erich 12/25/82 WCCW

3. Ricky Steamboat & Jay Youngblood vs Sgt Slaughter & Don Kernodle (Final Conflict Cage Match) 03/12/83 JCP

4. Hulk Hogan vs Nick BOckwinkel 04/24/83

4. Don Muraco vs Jimmy Snuka 10/17/83

4. Ric Flair vs Harley Race (Cage Match) 11/24/83 Starrcade

5. Hulk Hogan vs iron Sheik - WWF 1/23/84

6. Hulk Hogan & Mr T vs Roddy Piper & Paul Orndorff 3/31/85 WWF WrestleMania I

7. Ricky Steamboat vs Randy Savage WWF WrestleMania III 03/29/87

8. Hulk Hogan vs Andre the Giant (The Main Event)

9. Ric Flair vs Sting - Clash I

10. Terry Funk vs Sabu vs Shane Douglas

11. Shawn Michaels vs Razro Ramon (Ladder Match) WWF WRestleMania X

12. Eddy Guerrero vs Dean Malenko 2/3 Falls

13. Kevin Nash, Scott Hall & Mystery Partner (Hulk Hogan) vs Randy Savage, Sting & Lex Luger 07/07/96 WCW Bash at the Beatch

14. Bret Hart vs Steve Austin (Submission Match) WrestleMania XIII 3/23/97

15. Sabu vs Terry Funk Barbed Wire Match

16. Shawn Michaels vs Undertaker Hell in a Cell 10/97

17. Bret Hart vs Shawn Michaels 11/09/97 WWF Survivor Series

18. Hulk Hogan vs Sting 12/28/97 WCW Starrcade

19. Steve Austin vs Shawn Michaels Wrestlemania XIV

20. Mankind vs Undertaker Hell in a Cell 98

21. Rob Van Dam vs Jerry Lynn Whichever

22. Undertaker vs Lesnar WM30

 

 

Japan

1. Rikidozan & Masahiko Kimura vs Mike & Ben Sharpe 2/19/54
2. Rikidozan vs Lou Thesz 10/6/57
3. Rikidozan & Toyonobori lost to Jim Wright & Mr X (Bill Miller) 5/6/61
4. Rikidozan vs Fred Blassie 4/23/62
5. Rikidozan vs The Destroyer 5/24/63
6. The Destroyer vs Toyonobori - JWA 02/26/65
7. Giant Baba vs. Dick the Bruiser (11/24/65)
8. Giant Baba beat Fritz Von Erich 12/3/66
9. Giant Baba & Antonio Inoki vs Bill Watts & Tarzan Tyler 10/31/67
10. Antonio Inoki vs Karl Gotch 1972
11. Giant Baba vs The Destroyer 12/19/72 AJPW
12. Giant Baba vs Jack Brisco 12/2/74
13. Giant Baba vs Bruno Sammartino 05/09/75
14. Funk Brothers vs Abby & Sheik 12/15/77
15. Giant Baba & Antonio Inoki vs Tiger Jeet Singh & Abdullah the Butcher 08/26/79
16. Giant Baba vs Harley Race 10/31/79
17. Giant Baba vs Harley Race 09/04/80
18. Funk Brothers vs Brody & Snuka 1981 Tag League (Hansen Shows up)
19. Funk Brothers vs Hansen & Gordy 8/31/83
20. Riki Choshu vs Tatsumi Fujinami 04/03/83
21. Elimination Match 03/26/86
22. Riki Choshu, Masa Saito & Hiro Saito vs Akira Maeda, Nobuhiko Takada & Osamu Kido 11/19/87
23. Nobuhiko Takada KO Akira Maeda 11/11/88
24. Jumbo Tsuruta vs Genichiro Tenryu 06/05/89 AJPW
25. Jumbo Tsuruta vs Mitsuharu Misawa 06/08/90
26. Nobuhiko Takada vs Keiji Muto x2

 

 

Lucha

1. El Bulldog, Lobo Negro, Medico Asesino b Abel Krim, Gorillta Flores, Tonina Jackson Possible first trios match
2. Medico Asensino vs Gardenia Davis 1952
3. El Santo vs Black Shadow 11/7/52 Mask vs Mask
4. El Santo vs Blue Demon 9/27/53 NWA Welterweight Title Match (Santo loss)
5. El Santo & Henry Pilusso vs Espantos (I & II) 7/5/62 (First Santo match as tecnico)
6. El Santo vs Perro Aguayo (Mask vs Hair) 10/03/75
7. Dr Wagner Jr vs El Solitario (Mask vs Mask) 12/1/85 EMLL
8. Cien Caras vs Rayo de Jalisco Jr 09/21/90 EMLL
9. Konnan vs Cien Caras (Mask vs Mask) 4/30/93 AAA
10. Atlantis vs Villano III (Mask vs Mask) 03/17/00 EMLL
11. Atlantis vs Ultimo Guerrero (Mask vs Mask) 09/19/2014 CMLL

Women

1. Mildred Burke vs June Byers 8/25/54 Atlanta, GA

2. All Japan Women’s Pro Wrestling Championship All Star Shows 9/10/55 and 9/11/55 and on 1/4/56 and 1/5/56

3. Japan Woman's Pro Wrestling Association's first show on 4/29/67

4. Moolah's tour from 3/2 to 4/2 of '68

5. All Japan's first TV show on Fuji TV on 12/1/68

6. Jackie Sato vs Maki Ueda 11/01/77

7. Jaguar Yokota vs Jackie Sato 2/25/81

8. Mami Kumano & Devil Masami vs Ayumi Hori & Nancy Kumi 2/25/81

9. Fabulous Moolah vs Wendi Richter MTV

10. Mimi Hagiwara vs Yumi Ikeshita 2/25/81

11. Lioness vs Jaguar 8/22/85

12. Chigusa vs Devil 8/22/85

13. Dump vs Chigusa Hair vs Hair x2

14. Dump’s Retirement

15. Bull Nakano vs Aja Kong (Cage Match) 11/14/90

16. Hokuto vs Kandori 4/2/93

17. Dream Rush

18. Some Aja Kong vs Kansai Match

19. Kudo vs Toyoda Exploding Barbed Wire

Great Britain

1. Francis St Clair Gregory vs Mike Marino (aired 11/9/55)
2. Cliff Beaumont vs Bert Royal (aired 11/9/55)
3. Kendo Nagasaki vs. Count Bartelli mask vs. mask (3/5/66)
4. White Angel vs. Doctor Death mask match (4/4/62)
5. McManus vs. Pallo Cup Final Day match from '62 (5/5/62)
6. Big Daddy vs Giant Haystacks 06/18/81 Wembley
7. Daddy vs. Quinn from Wembley (6/27/79)

Don't know what the fuck to do with it:

1. Antonio Inoki vs Muhammad Ali 6/25/76

[JerryvonKramer]

Great list. Minor correction: Bruno / Ivan was 71.

[elliott]

Fixed. Thank you. Weird typo. I'll go back through and add dates on the ones I missed and everyone please keep the suggestions coming.

[JerryvonKramer]

I feel like Penny Banner vs June Byers was a famous match. Just remember hearing about it.

[ButchReedMark]

Here's a pretty good example, It's Giant Haystacks on They Think It's All Over, which was a sports-themed comedy show that went out in the late 90s:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9-kgnTNKh8

 

Gary Lineker (football star, tv personality, current host of MOTD) worked out that it was Haystacks after a minute or so. I guarantee you that he couldn't have done that with any other wrestler other than Big Daddy himself.

 

It's a comedy panel show. A penny to the pound he was fed who'd be his "Feel the Sportsman" by the production team prior to taping. Panel shows are meticulously planned and actually have pretty much no spontaneity whatsoever, despite the "off the cuff" on-air presentation. Adam Buxton and others who have appeared on them have written blogs on it.

 

You're right on Giant Haystacks being very well known in the mainstream, it's a dodgy source though is that.

 

Anecdotally, the elder gents in the pub when they mention the old WoS talents are likely to name Daddy, Stacks, McManus, Les Kellet, Sid Cooper, Catweazle and Jim Breaks.

[JerryvonKramer]

I guess we could say "it would be believable that Lineker would get the answer", even if he was fed it by production.

[ohtani's jacket]

Parv & Alan,

 

I get that Haystacks and Daddy were household names, and still are to some extent years after their deaths, but people having some vague idea that they fought at "Wembley" doesn't make it the most important match in British wrestling history. Not when they sold out Wembley two years prior with Daddy vs. Quinn and not when it led to a downturn in wrestling's popularity instead of adding to it like McManus/Pallo did. Aside from the fact that Daddy vs. Haystacks was held at Wembley Arena and not the Wembley Town Hall, I can't think of a single reason why Daddy/Haystacks was better, or more important, than McManus/Pallo, other than the generation that witnessed McManus vs. Pallo has largely died out.

 

McManus/Pallo was the better match, had the better build, did the better rating (per head of population/TV set), led to greater things in terms of wrestling's popularity, and the pair hobnobbed with the Queen Mother, the Duke of Edinburgh, Sandie Shaw, the Beatles and Richard Attenborough not bloody Noel Edmund and Bruce Foresyth. Wrestling was never more mainstream or accepted in England than it was in the 60s.

 

The reason I mentioned the match not being well remembered is that I don't think people are actually reminiscing upon the match. 1981 was a long time ago. People may have fond memories of Botham in the Ashes but the better judge of how important the Botham Ashes were is how relevant they were at the time. I don't think the Haystacks/Daddy match mattered a month later let alone a year. They actually rode a re-match into the ground when Daddy won convincingly enough. I already mentioned knowing about Andre vs. Hogan long before I ever saw it and I think Daddy vs. Haystacks is folklore at best.

 

And to be frank, if that's the most important match in British wrestling history then the history of British wrestling is pretty sad. Thankfully. it's not -- on both accounts.

[ohtani's jacket]

Elliot, Baba swapping the NWA title with Race prior to Jumbo becoming the ace was important. Also Baba winning the NWA International Heavyweight title that later became part of the Triple Crown.

[Al]

Montreal: Henri Deglane vs Strangler Lewis might deserve a mention. The original Montreal screwjob.

 

If we're looking at Britain, is Smith/Hart at Wembley worth a mention or is it more or a one time thing?

 

Actually, Big Daddy vs Malcolm Kirk might have an argument as a historic match. It may have been the final death blow for that era of wrestling.

[ButchReedMark]

The reason I mentioned the match not being well remembered is that I don't think people are actually reminiscing upon the match. 1981 was a long time ago. People may have fond memories of Botham in the Ashes but the better judge of how important the Botham Ashes were is how relevant they were at the time.

 

Neither here nor there, but Bob "Well Charles..." Willis has never had the credit he deserved for his performance in the all important Headingley test in my eyes.

[JerryvonKramer]

Can't we just say something like McManus / Pallo was the Londos / Strangler Lewis and Daddy / Haystacks was the Hogan / Andre?

[dedhemingway]

I don't think how 'good' a match is, or even how well it drew, are necessary for it to be an important match. They can be part of it, certainly, but it's possible for a match to be important without it.

 

I saw Foley/Taker in HIAC mentioned. How about the match that inspired Foley? Snuka/Muraco in the cage. Are we getting too reductive at that point?

 

I'd also argue for Superstar/Bruno in '77, which showed that a guy who was a lesser wrestler, but a better showman, could thrive in NY, leading to Hogan.

[ohtani's jacket]

Can't we just say something like McManus / Pallo was the Londos / Strangler Lewis and Daddy / Haystacks was the Hogan / Andre?

 

McManus/Pallo wasn't that bloody long ago.

 

I ask you this, Parv:

 

Were the Stones fans of Big Daddy?

 

http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BK_187mCQAIHdDO.jpg:large

 

Was Prince Philip eager to meet him?

 

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/05/22/article-2329043-0040428A00000258-352_634x462.jpg

 

Did Big Daddy get to horse around with Tony Cooper?

 

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/05/22/article-2329043-0060B09500000258-611_634x531.jpg

 

Did he put Pete Murray in headlocks?

 

http://ichef-1.bbci.co.uk/news/624/media/images/67896000/jpg/_67896015_3167552.jpg

 

McManus is in the National Biography for crying out loud.

 

I know there are people who push hard for Daddy in the HOF each year, but McManus was the most famous and important wrestler in the history of British wrestling.

[ohtani's jacket]

Since I was being lazy here are the dates for these:

Great Britain

1. Francis St Clair Gregory vs Mike Marino (aired 11/9/55)
2. Cliff Beaumont vs Bert Royal (aired 11/9/55)
3. Kendo Nagasaki vs. Count Bartelli mask vs. mask (3/5/66)
4. White Angel vs. Doctor Death mask match (4/4/62)
5. McManus vs. Pallo Cup Final Day match from '62 (5/5/62)
6. Big Daddy vs Giant Haystacks 06/18/81 Wembley
7. Daddy vs. Quinn from Wembley (6/27/79)

 

There was some discrepancy about which matches aired on the 1/13/65 broadcast so I would nix those.

 

I forgot that McManus and Pallo had a rematch on the '63 Cup FInal Day show. The date was 5/25/63. I believe this is the match that was claimed to have been seen by over 20 million people.