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The WWE HOF audience makes me embarrassed to be a wrestling fan


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#21 Bix

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 02:18 PM

I'd say that's a different variety of stupidity.

#22 anarchistxx

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 02:26 PM

Problem is, a lot of wrestling fans are society's rejects. There's got to be a reason for that.

#23 Guest_robgomm_*

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 02:59 PM

Please stop generalising about wrestling fans. Any debate over why people cheered on hearing Chris Benoit's name is overshadowed when people start talking about "wrestling fans" being this or that. I am a wrestling fan and I would not have cheered Benoit's name. My impression for a while has been that a lot of people don't have a true understanding of what Benoit really did. If they did, they surely wouldn't cheer. The main news coverage I saw was so sensational, so full of bullshit that it was difficult to feel any real emotion about what had happened. People who know the intimate details of the case (ie: you guys) aren't about to cheer Benoit. Most people don't know those details and so perhaps they associate Benoit with other dead wrestlers, not differentiating between him and Eddie Guerrero. Even then, it's hard to explain because they must know that Benoit killed his wife and son. I'd like to hear the views of fans on that - not the conspiracy theorists, the ones who know the basics of what happened but cheered on hearing Benoit's name. Personally speaking, I think WWE trying to bury the memory of what happened by not mentioning it has helped foster this weird atmosphere and I think they should've been up front and honest about it. But it's hard to criticise them for trying to move on when they were all grieving. I'm confused on a lot of this stuff but just burying wrestling fans is a total cop out.

#24 Bix

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 03:10 PM

Please stop generalising about wrestling fans. Any debate over why people cheered on hearing Chris Benoit's name is overshadowed when people start talking about "wrestling fans" being this or that. I am a wrestling fan and I would not have cheered Benoit's name.

I'm a wrestling fan and so is everyone else at this board. My point is that I don't care about people making negative generalizations about wrestling fans anymore, because it sure looks like they're right about the majority.

My impression for a while has been that a lot of people don't have a true understanding of what Benoit really did. If they did, they surely wouldn't cheer. The main news coverage I saw was so sensational, so full of bullshit that it was difficult to feel any real emotion about what had happened. People who know the intimate details of the case (ie: you guys) aren't about to cheer Benoit. Most people don't know those details and so perhaps they associate Benoit with other dead wrestlers, not differentiating between him and Eddie Guerrero. Even then, it's hard to explain because they must know that Benoit killed his wife and son. I'd like to hear the views of fans on that - not the conspiracy theorists, the ones who know the basics of what happened but cheered on hearing Benoit's name. Personally speaking, I think WWE trying to bury the memory of what happened by not mentioning it has helped foster this weird atmosphere and I think they should've been up front and honest about it. But it's hard to criticise them for trying to move on when they were all grieving.

I'm confused on a lot of this stuff but just burying wrestling fans is a total cop out.

It's well known that he violently killed his wife and son before killing himself. While the majority doesn't know that the Crippler Crossface was used to kill Daniel, or that Chris was beating Nancy for years (though more would know this as it got decent mainstream coverage), or other more obscure stuff, they know the key details, and that's all that matters. If they question it without doing research, then they're idiots. If they question it after doing research, then they're idiots. You are right that it would be interesting to hear the views of that group of fans and the reasoning behind it, because I can't wrap my head around it.

#25 Guest_robgomm_*

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 03:31 PM

You should care about negative generalisations of wrestling fans because, when someone does that, they are making negative generalisations about you. I'll certainly defend fans like you who are able to see the joy in pro-wrestling while, even more creditably, being able to see the faults.

#26 Bix

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 03:54 PM

Anyone who makes a sweeping generalization about all wrestling fans is an idiot, anyway. Making a generalization about many/most...not as much, at least not automatically. And in all these arguments, it amazes me how hard it is in various places for people to agree on the fact that cheering a murderer is bad.

#27 Ray

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 05:26 PM

Shouldn't Flair take some hits for mentioning Benoit's name in the first place?

#28 Jingus

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 06:00 PM

That's what I was thinking. Not like Flair has never made an inappropriate decision in his life, but you'd think he'd know better than that.

#29 Tim Evans

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 11:47 PM

Come on Bix does this really shock you? It's the WWE hall of fame. Leave you class at the door. I agree with you that it is pretty sad that they cheered Benoit's name. And what made me really sad about wrestling fans is sitting in the crowd tonight hearing some fans want to do physical harm to John Cena. And how did you feel Bix about HHH doing the Crossface at mania? I was shocked.

#30 jdw

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Posted 30 March 2008 - 11:56 PM

You should care about negative generalisations of wrestling fans because, when someone does that, they are making negative generalisations about you.


At this point, who cares if people make negative generalisations of wrestling fans? You've been a wrestling fan for how long? Haven't you learned to shrug off the ones that don't apply to you?

Non-Fan: "Did you hear about those fans who give the big ovation to the killer Benoit?"

Me: "Yeah."

Non-Fan: "Wrestling fans are some sick fucks."

Me: "Yeah, I would have been embarassed to be in that crowd."

It's not complicated. We've been doing that shit as long as we've been fans and face the negative generalisations of wrestling fans. We tend to respond by how the generalizations fit in with *us*.

Non-Fan: "Wrestling fans are idiots for believing that fake stuff."

Me: "I always have know it was fake, just like those guys on CSI are fake crime lab guys. They're both just entertainment."

After 20+ years, I'm not sure why any of us get too worked up with the generalizations. We all know how to deal with them.

The comment on whether Flair should take some hits for this, I'd say more than the fans.

John

#31 Guest_DietSoda_*

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 01:04 AM

What did you want them to do, give him heel heat for killing his wife and son? Start a "Chris killed Daniel" chant? It's wrestling. Benoits choice was a personal choice. Benoit to wrestling fans is just Benoit the wrestler, not the psycho who killed his family. You weren't there, I wasn't there, nor were any of his biggest fans there. Stop trying to be some smarky insider elitest and learn to seperate Benoit the murder and Benoit the ring artist and I think you'll figure out why WRESTLING fans are going to cheer his name.

#32 Guest_The 3H's_*

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 01:21 AM

What did you want them to do, give him heel heat for killing his wife and son? Start a "Chris killed Daniel" chant?

It's wrestling. Benoits choice was a personal choice. Benoit to wrestling fans is just Benoit the wrestler, not the psycho who killed his family. You weren't there, I wasn't there, nor were any of his biggest fans there. Stop trying to be some smarky insider elitest and learn to seperate Benoit the murder and Benoit the ring artist and I think you'll figure out why WRESTLING fans are going to cheer his name.


Are you fucking retarded?

#33 ohtani's jacket

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 01:44 AM

That's what I was thinking. Not like Flair has never made an inappropriate decision in his life, but you'd think he'd know better than that.


That's also what I thought. Wasn't Flair illicting a pop by mentioning his name?

#34 Loss

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 05:44 AM

I agree that Flair had nothing to gain from mentioning his name. I do acknowledge that Benoit was someone he was associated with in the last few years of WCW, but if he can get through a HOF speech without mentioning Sting, which apparently he didn't, then he can get through a HOF speech without mentioning Benoit. That said, I do think it says something that those fans find John Cena's main event run more offensive than Chris Benoit killing his wife and son.

#35 Bix

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 06:59 AM

Come on Bix does this really shock you? It's the WWE hall of fame. Leave you class at the door. I agree with you that it is pretty sad that they cheered Benoit's name.

And what made me really sad about wrestling fans is sitting in the crowd tonight hearing some fans want to do physical harm to John Cena. And how did you feel Bix about HHH doing the Crossface at mania? I was shocked.

I get the idea of wanting to "take back" the crossface (no way do they have any other intention) so I don't necessarily have a problem with it even if it still feels weird as someone had to use it eventually.

#36 jdw

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 09:13 AM

It's wrestling. Benoits choice was a personal choice. Benoit to wrestling fans is just Benoit the wrestler, not the psycho who killed his family. You weren't there, I wasn't there, nor were any of his biggest fans there. Stop trying to be some smarky insider elitest and learn to seperate Benoit the murder and Benoit the ring artist and I think you'll figure out why WRESTLING fans are going to cheer his name.


I didn't think it was being a smarky insider elitest to think Benoit killing his wife and pre-teen son was pretty fucking sick.

Some of us as *humans* aren't able to separate Benoit the the murder from Benoit the "ring artist". It really has nothing to do with being a "smarky insider elitest".

I think a typical "smarky insider elitest" like yourself is probably more comfortable ignoring the murders so that Benoits work can still entertain you.


John

#37 Bix

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 09:24 AM

Don't feed the trolls, John.

#38 S.L.L.

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 09:34 AM

Man, if I ever do a 7x7 Wrestling Death Apologist Bingo card, I must remember to include "murder is a personal choice, and we should not be judgmental about it". Even if it's only been used once, and likely just for trolling purposes, it's too good to ignore.

#39 MikeCampbell

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 10:29 AM

Bix, I don't disagree with your original point in the least. It's very fucked up to hear people cheer the mere mention of his name, especially while riding Cena's ass all night. I'd chalk it up to people just wanting to be different for the hell of it. And the Benoit defenders are quite annoying. The WWE's attempt to erase him has almost him a victim of sorts. However (and no, I'm not trolling I'm being dead serious here), is it really that hard to separate Benoit the wrestler from Benoit the person? I accepted it a long time ago: What Chris Benoit did is a tragedy and is both unforgivable and unforgettable. I doubt any wrestling fans can ever think of Benoit without remembering what did that weekend. That said, it doesn't, nor should it (IMO) change that fact that he was amongst the best wrestlers in the world and spent a good number of years putting on matches that a good number of us enjoyed.

#40 Guest_*FH*_*

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Posted 31 March 2008 - 11:07 AM

The WWE HOF audience makes me embarrassed to be a wrestling fan


I assumed this thread would be about wrestling fans not being able to dress like fucking grown ups despite being told to do so.

Then again, "Business Attire" was specified, so I guess I should be glad they didn't show up in their Wal Mart uniforms. A HHH t-shirt and dirty jeans is probably Sunday best.




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