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"He's ambitiously stupid" - Why Scott Keith's new book is scary bad


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#21 kjh

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Posted 13 September 2008 - 02:56 PM

If that was only a brief expose of Keith's fuck up's, I imagine it could take days to type up all the other stuff.

Someone should email him this thread.


Go ahead, but the odds are high he wouldn't give a shit. I remember Todd Martin reviewing one of his earlier books where he took him to task for his sloppy fact checking and he responded like it was no big deal. Also better fact checking wouldn't change his offensive opinions and shallow conclusions which he's had over a year to formulate.

#22 Boondocks Kernoodle

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Posted 13 September 2008 - 03:15 PM

Keith will always put a wrestler's on-screen behavior over their real-life behavior as criteria for his opinion of them. I was reading his blog a couple of months ago and he said something to the effect of that he lost some respect for Austin when he beat Debra, but more when he would bury midcarders by beating them up after he retired.

#23 S.L.L.

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Posted 13 September 2008 - 04:40 PM

Just from what you've posted, it's scary the lengths he (SK) feels he needs to go to in order to defend Benoit: the performer vs. Benoit: the murderer. I dunno, seems like there's some kind of middle ground where you can admit that he was a great wrestler, but a piece of shit human. I mean, aren't most of them?


Certainly, and most of the ones who aren't still seem to have some kind of horrifying dark side to them. But some people really don't want to hear that. They don't handle the great performer/shitty person disconnect very well, but they've become too attached to the great performer to let go, so they dismiss the reality to maintain the fantasy. Skeith seems to fit this profile quite nicely.

If that was only a brief expose of Keith's fuck up's, I imagine it could take days to type up all the other stuff.

Someone should email him this thread.


Go ahead, but the odds are high he wouldn't give a shit. I remember Todd Martin reviewing one of his earlier books where he took him to task for his sloppy fact checking and he responded like it was no big deal. Also better fact checking wouldn't change his offensive opinions and shallow conclusions which he's had over a year to formulate.


In fairness, Martin's review was about as bad as SKeith's book. I would've dismissed it offhand, too.

On the other hand, Tim himself got the very same reaction from SKeith for writing him a counterpoint to his review of Eddy/JBL from Judgment Day '04, which Skeith then posted at the beginning of a later review and framed it as something wacky he received from "known loon" Tim Cooke, and then proceeded to show it in full without commenting further on it, presumably because it's ridiculousness spoke for itself. Except, of course, it was a totally well-reasoned piece, and I'm told a number of Scooter's boosters actually ended up agreeing with Cooke. So, if nothing else, sending this to him might trick him into posting a counterpoint to his ramblings that could even get some of his followers to see how out of touch he is, but maybe he'd know better this time around.

#24 tekcop

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Posted 13 September 2008 - 07:32 PM

- YOU ARE A MORON. "Animal, showing what a class act he is, returned to the WWE in 2005 and formed "The New Legion of Doom" (the third such kick at that particular can, following 1992's Crush & Animal and 1998's Droz & Animal) with the god-awful John Heidenreich, and they actually won the Smackdown version of the tag titles to really spit on Hawk's grave."

So, according to Keith, if you start a successful business with a partner and he dies a couple of decadeS later, it would be immoral for you to find a new partner to help keep your company afloat. Is that about right?

#25 sek69

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Posted 13 September 2008 - 10:06 PM

Well a couple of things about our pal Scooter: 1. He's got so much of a fanbase (yes that is scary but apparently true) that it doesn't matter how shitty his books are, there will be enough sold to get him another book deal. 2. Pre Crippler-Crossgate, Benoit was this man's personal Savior. The compartmentalizing and justification he does are probably what keeps him holding on to his last grip of sanity. We like to bust wildpegasus' balls over his fandom but I'm almost positive Keith had a shrine and a wall covered with Benoit photos. The whole great worker + Canadian thing was basically stroke material. Also he's currently on a kick of watching recent shows/PPVs and then trying to sound above it all. Like the last PPV he "ranted" on, he tried to sound too cool for school and make a comment on how the women in the Smackdown divas match (Michelle McCool and Maryse) were interchangeable just because they were both blonde. Even his commenters had to point out that they have 2 very different gimmicks and the only way you could think they were interchangeable would be if you didn't watch Smackdown and were just trying to score generic "women are teh suxxorz" points.

#26 Bob Morris

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 12:38 AM

What has bothered me the most about Keith are two things: 1. He doesn't proofread his stuff very well. Notice how a couple of things Bix quoted would have been made more accurate just by simply changing a word or two. 2. He goes around quoting stuff from other sources without citing them. Most other authors at least provide a bibliography so you know what materials they used to support their work. Keith just seems to assume everybody has seen it, so he just uses it. Case in point: Some of the stuff he tosses out is stuff that is garnered from RF Video shoot interviews, which a very small number of wrestling fans watch. Heck, we already have something he took from the Superstar Billy Graham DVD and I've never seen it, so how would I know Graham made such a quote in it?

#27 sek69

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 03:39 AM

Horrible opinions and questionable values aside, dude is a terrible writer. Even if it wasn't chock full of errors it would still be unreadable shit since he writes like the pro wres equivalent to a know-it-all academic who talks out of his ass. It also shows how terrible his publisher must be since obviously no one proofread it before it went to print. Someone should email Dave a copy just so we can look forward to an entire WON devoted to him tearing the shit out of ol' Scoot.

#28 Boondocks Kernoodle

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 04:43 AM

I doubt Dave even cares about Scooter. Remember that thinly-veiled insult he made towards him in his Christmas day update so many years back?

#29 sek69

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 06:03 PM

I have no doubt Dave could give less of a shit about Scooter, but he does seem to take issue with Benoit-related books that may have a detail or two inaccurate.

#30 Dylan Waco

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Posted 14 September 2008 - 08:29 PM

Thank you for doing this. Do more!

:)

Or maybe I shouldn't wish that on you, I don't know.


It's really, really bad.

I got an advance copy via leakage a week or so again myself. I couldn't believe how awful it was, and my standards for wrestling books are very low

#31 Guest_Autoclave_*

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Posted 15 September 2008 - 11:09 PM

"...it's not like WCW was taking in a crack addict or anything" has to be the best part. Amazing.

#32 Loss

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 05:41 AM

It's the first time I've ever seen the WWF criticized for firing Dave Boy Smith (and the Ultimate Warrior, but he probably deserved it more for not being as good in the ring as Davey Boy, I guess). That's usually considered one of the few times WWE was completely serious and fair about enforcing their drug policy. They fired two top stars who were both being pushed.

#33 MikeCampbell

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 01:49 PM

Has anyone read Keith's first book 'The Buzz on Pro Wrestling?' all the Keith book bashing seemd to start with Tonight In This Very Ring. Did he actually get something right with the first one, or is it so bad that nobody mentions it?

#34 Bix

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 02:05 PM

I'm guessing that nobody read it because it was less ambitious than the other books.

#35 Guest_Iron Chad_*

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 02:32 PM

Don't worry Mike, all of Keith's books suck. I think "The Buzz" is the one with the hilariously bad chronological history of the NWA title that even Tony Schiavone would think was wack. -Chad

#36 MikeCampbell

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 03:38 PM

Oh, now that you mention that, I think I do recall hearing about it. Didn't he claim that Buddy Rogers won the NWA Title from Lou Thesz? And that the NWA was formed in the '60's? I was mentioning this thread to buddy of mine, specifically the awesome 'ambitiously stupid' comment that Bix stole, and he mentioned he had the first one. I was thinking about asking if I could borrow it and maybe do the epic review that Bix wants, but now maybe not.

#37 Jingus

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 03:57 PM

Did he actually get something right with the first one, or is it so bad that nobody mentions it?

It's just forgettable. It's meant to be sort of a beginner's primer for wrestling. Let's say that the kindest praise I can give it is that it's not worse than Lou Albano's contribution with Idiot's Guide To Pro Wrestling. It's a very general overview and history thing which has been done a hundred times. The editors also tarted it up with a bunch of annoying illustrations which look like something out of a children's magazine.

#38 Boondocks Kernoodle

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 04:06 PM

Wasn't "The Buzz" just some project that the original author abandoned so Scott was chosen to pick it up?

#39 Bix

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 04:49 PM

I believe so.

#40 Bob Morris

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Posted 16 September 2008 - 07:18 PM

One of the problems with "Buzz" is that there's a timeline that was obviously lifted from a PWI Alamanac... and as I recall, Scott didn't even know that was being done. That might explain the question about him finishing a project the original author dropped. Jingus is correct it was done in line with the "beginner primer" guide in mind... there are several other "Buzz" books promo'ed on the back (Buzz on Wine was one people joked about a bit during the Rantsylvania days). Really, though, it was his second book that smacked of the most laziness, as it was mostly stuff he had written on the Internet and just reprinted for the book.




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