Boss Rock Posted August 26, 2017 Report Share Posted August 26, 2017 A lot of the criticisms I've come across regarding Cena's selling (I've even had a few myself) is that he pops up or manages some kind of reversal 30-60 seconds after taking a big move, which to be fair isn't all that out of place in a NJPW match (and this is coming from a huge NJPW fan). But I think there are a lot instances where Cena's selling made his opponent seem like a huge threat (the Khali and Brock matches come to mind). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iamthedoctor Posted August 26, 2017 Report Share Posted August 26, 2017 What's the best Cena-Show match? It seems like they've feuded at least five or six times, right? Probably their match at Wrestlemania for the US title. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted August 26, 2017 Report Share Posted August 26, 2017 What's the best Cena-Show match? It seems like they've feuded at least five or six times, right? Probably their match at Wrestlemania for the US title. Seriously guys. It's on Smackdown 27.2.09. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted August 26, 2017 Report Share Posted August 26, 2017 A lot of the criticisms I've come across regarding Cena's selling (I've even had a few myself) is that he pops up or manages some kind of reversal 30-60 seconds after taking a big move, which to be fair isn't all that out of place in a NJPW match (and this is coming from a huge NJPW fan). But I think there are a lot instances where Cena's selling made his opponent seem like a huge threat (the Khali and Brock matches come to mind). I don't think it was as much selling with Brock as it was when Brock was legit beating the shit out of people for a while until he remembered it's a work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Thread Killer Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 Larry Csonka (who I know is hardly the most reliable source in the world) reported this today... According to The Wrestling Observer Newsletter, the reason Baron Corbin lost his MITB briefcase and has been cooled off has nothing to do with John Cena or Corbin’s actions on Twitter, although his actions on Twitter didn’t win him fans with his co-workers; it’s considered bad form to go on a blocking spree of your fellow wrestlers. The WON reports that he has been cooled off due to, “an entirely different situation outside the ring that happened a few weeks ago.” This means one of two things. Either the WON did provide more details and Csonka isn't passing it on (possible) or more likely, Dave Meltzer is doing another one of his famous "I know the real reason something happened, and I'm going to tell you that I know, but I'm not going to actually report on the details of what I know" deals. I HATE when he does that. He's done it several times over the past couple of years, and it drives me nuts. If you're a reporter, and you have a story, then report the damn story. If you can't report the story for whatever reason (don't want to give a source, can't confirm the story, whatever) then DON'T SAY ANYTHING. The whole topic of Baron Corbin's suddenly aborted push and speculation regarding whether or not John Cena is the reason is a very hot story right now. To me, nonsense like this report is the equivalent of a little kid dancing around chanting "I've got a secret, na-na-na-nana." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted August 31, 2017 Report Share Posted August 31, 2017 That's pretty what the WON reported word for word. Normally when Dave relays a story like that it's either he verified the story enough to know something happened but not enough to be 100% clear on the details, or it involves someone he's not comfortable outing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JNLister Posted September 1, 2017 Report Share Posted September 1, 2017 Or he's been told the story on background, meaning he can't publish it (even without attribution) unless he gets somebody else to confirm it, but he can use it to inform his reporting, in this case to print that the reason isn't Cena or Twitter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted September 1, 2017 Author Report Share Posted September 1, 2017 Agreed. You'll notice there are certain types of issues Dave has always talked around where he trusts his readers to understand what he means and why he's not elaborating. I don't know that this is that, but we'll see if his follow-up reporting goes in that direction. Sometimes, that's to protect himself for legal reasons, but more often, it's because Dave doesn't break anything that could damage someone in wrestling personally. You might hear about political maneuvering or Vince's latest obsession, but Dave himself isn't going to break domestic violence stories, drug and alcohol issues, or infidelity, even when he knows about it. As a more known example, remember that Randy Orton "violated a company policy" before WM22, and he left it at that. We only later found out that he was smoking pot out in the open in front of everyone. Sometimes, Dave is overly vague and ends up having to issue clarification after the fact when people read something that isn't there. If that's the case with Corbin, I trust that he'll do that, just like he always has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Liska Posted September 1, 2017 Report Share Posted September 1, 2017 Yeah, this isn't one I would get mad at Dave about. There's enough news there. Corbin is being punished and it's not for all the rumored reasons like his Twitter stuff. That's relevant info for a guy they've been behind so much. And I trust Dave after all this time that there's a reason he's not elaborating more. It's like when Mauro first missed an SD and they said it was because of travel issues and Dave just said that wasn't true. Turns out Mauro was having serious mental health issues and Dave didn't want to report that. But he was still ahead of the story and everyone else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Liska Posted September 2, 2017 Report Share Posted September 2, 2017 Damn it today Dave tweeted out a link to RealHero's archive which is invaluable for those of us that like to be able to watch non-NJPW puro that we otherwise wouldn't have access to. Hopefully the wrong people don't see it. Dave's been confused about this thing since he called it the AJPW streaming service. The good thing is he loved the two main events so hopefully that gets some space in the Observer and more people start paying attention to AJPW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted September 3, 2017 Report Share Posted September 3, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted September 3, 2017 Report Share Posted September 3, 2017 Considering it's Maroon, isn't Corbin the "face" in this situation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirEdger Posted September 3, 2017 Report Share Posted September 3, 2017 Not to WWE if he's questioning their top doctor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted September 3, 2017 Report Share Posted September 3, 2017 Oh yeah of course. I just find it kinda funny when the one time Corbin might be the "good guy" in a backstage story is when he finally gets in trouble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted September 4, 2017 Report Share Posted September 4, 2017 Maroon's an interesting case, in wrestling circles he's seen as the guy erring on the side of caution like with Daniel Bryan. In football circles, he's seen as a key part of the NFL's attempt at plausible deniability. It's like he's a face in one territory and a heel in another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyPulis'Cap Posted September 4, 2017 Report Share Posted September 4, 2017 Maroon's an interesting case, in wrestling circles he's seen as the guy erring on the side of caution like with Daniel Bryan. In football circles, he's seen as a key part of the NFL's attempt at plausible deniability. It's like he's a face in one territory and a heel in another. I'm not sure in the eyes of some fans if that makes him a face or a heel... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmare007 Posted September 4, 2017 Report Share Posted September 4, 2017 I feel he's seen more as a company puppet because even though he's been adamant about Bryan's health, he hasn't been with any other talent. Shit, Tommy Dreamer had a damn tables match in 2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted September 4, 2017 Report Share Posted September 4, 2017 As far as I'm aware Tommy never admitted to having seizures either. I'd wager if he never mentioned that he'd probably be still wrestling. Once that was on the record, there's no way a company that has multiple pending concussion lawsuits against them is going to ever clear him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted September 4, 2017 Report Share Posted September 4, 2017 So fightful.com just put up their story about it, and in the middle of it they just casually mentioned Corbin is part of the concussion lawsuit against the NFL. What? That seems like burying the lede, to say the least. A guy who's part of a lawsuit against the NFL due to concussions is presumably cleared to wrestle by the guy who famously stated there was no firm link between concussions and CTE and was on the NFL's payroll? No wonder he said something about it. Having Maroon do a seminar on concussion safety is like having the CEO of Philip Morris do one on cancer awareness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeg Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 Maroon is a guy who sides with whoever is paying him. He doesn't strike me as a man with any integrity, which is probably how he ended up in the wrestling business. If you want him to clear a player because you need him on the field, Maroon will clear the player. If you need him to hold a wrestler out and not clear him to set an example because you are being sued, then he can do that too. He never seems to have the athletes best interest at heart when treating athletes but rather his employers best interest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 Dave has now declared Donovan Dijak vs Keith Lee was the best match this year in the US and on par with Taker/Michaels 1 from Mania. I just can't take Dave anymore. He's so obviously shilling these days and there's no way in hell he can truly even believe the stuff he says. And it's one thing if its just him trying to boost sales, but people are buying it and then repeating it, and I got to deal with those little shits every single day. I would even go as far to say that this shit is a reason why I don't even watch wrestling any more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Liska Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 Dave has now declared Donovan Dijak vs Keith Lee was the best match this year in the US and on par with Taker/Michaels 1 from Mania. I just can't take Dave anymore. He's so obviously shilling these days and there's no way in hell he can truly even believe the stuff he says. And it's one thing if its just him trying to boost sales, but people are buying it and then repeating it, and I got to deal with those little shits every single day. I would even go as far to say that this shit is a reason why I don't even watch wrestling any more. I think Dave genuinely believes that when he says it. I'm a little uncomfortable with how much PWG panders to him and makes him part of the show and how he's friends with everyone, but it's not like it really matters, they're a very small promotion in the whole scheme of things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SomethingSavage Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 Ugh. You "got to" deal with these people every day? Do ya really "got to", or do you choose to? It's a hobby, folks. For the life of me, I'll never understand why some people take these things so seriously. It's a guy's opinion. I understand he's considered the most influential and all that. No question. But he's one guy. He digs what he digs. You are still free to enjoy what you enjoy or even *gasp* disagree with him on things. I'm sure I'll always be the outlier on this, but it is what it is. I just can't wrap my head around people feeling all sensitive about his ratings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sek69 Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 I mean, don't most forms of entertainment pander to some degree? Is what PWG doing any different than when movie studios make "Oscar bait" films? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rzombie1988 Posted September 5, 2017 Report Share Posted September 5, 2017 Ugh. You "got to" deal with these people every day? Do ya really "got to", or do you choose to? It's a hobby, folks. For the life of me, I'll never understand why some people take these things so seriously. It's a guy's opinion. I understand he's considered the most influential and all that. No question. But he's one guy. He digs what he digs. You are still free to enjoy what you enjoy or even *gasp* disagree with him on things. I'm sure I'll always be the outlier on this, but it is what it is. I just can't wrap my head around people feeling all sensitive about his ratings. I have to. I want what is best for wrestling. I want it to succeed and I want everyone in the world to watch it. I want every show to sell out and I want everyone to be rich and healthy. I care about wrestling, because I'm going to be around in another 20 years discussing it. Wrestling is a part of me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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