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#41 khawk20

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 08:30 AM

Late to the party, but a lot of that has to do with what videotape cost back in the day. This was a problem that wasn't exclusive to wrestling, either, as networks would re-use tape for broadcasting, especially when it had stuff on that they didn't think people would re-watch. Best example of this is the first Super Bowl, as no full footage of the game exists (it got taped over by soap operas). It's very different today, as it's a lot more affordable for both companies and individuals to document just about anything. Stampede was mentioned by you and others and it wasn't just Stampede that felt that wrath here in Canada, as there have been some hockey games (famous ones in fact) from over the years that were never kept or had to be reattained in other ways/means.


This is why it always surprises me that Verne Gagne saved tape from as far back as he did (at least 1966, hopefully earlier). Must've cost him a fortune not re-using tape...unless the format he was using couldn't be used twice.

Even then, the foresight to try and save the footage is unusual in wrestling from that time frame, I think, at least in North America.

Now I have heard that his storage methods were sub-standard and a lot of what he had is no longer usable, which sucks. But again, at least he tried to hold onto it.

#42 Loss

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 08:34 AM

Keeping footage and hating Hogan ... Verne Gagne was wrestling's first smark. :)

#43 Jingus

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 12:18 PM

Late to the party, but a lot of that has to do with what videotape cost back in the day. This was a problem that wasn't exclusive to wrestling, either, as networks would re-use tape for broadcasting, especially when it had stuff on that they didn't think people would re-watch.

Yeah. A lot of the early episodes of Doctor Who have been lost for the same reason, the BBC just recorded other shit over them.

This is why it always surprises me that Verne Gagne saved tape from as far back as he did (at least 1966, hopefully earlier). Must've cost him a fortune not re-using tape...

Verne being in that nursing home room which was cheap enough that he had a roommate suddenly makes more sense.

#44 jdw

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Posted 21 February 2012 - 12:29 PM

Late to the party, but a lot of that has to do with what videotape cost back in the day. This was a problem that wasn't exclusive to wrestling, either, as networks would re-use tape for broadcasting, especially when it had stuff on that they didn't think people would re-watch.

Yeah. A lot of the early episodes of Doctor Who have been lost for the same reason, the BBC just recorded other shit over them.


Dr Who and a lot of other BBC shows. Wiki's article is pretty solid on how tape was treated in those days:

Doctor Who missing episodes

Which as pretty similar to how a lot of lower level stuff in the US (such as wrestling) was treated.

John

#45 Al

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 04:15 PM

On the last Monty Python documentary, one of the Pythons (I think Terry Jones) told the story about buying the master tapes from the BBC to prevent them from being wiped as well. Gotch/Hackenschmidt. Was that ever taped? If it was, was it the victim of nitrate deterioration?

#46 Loss

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 04:30 PM

The black and white match at the beginning of the WWE opening is from 1901, and is Roeber (not sure first name) vs August Faust. Before that clip rolled out, I think Stetcher/Caddock from 1/30/20 was the oldest match believed to exist on tape. Pretty interesting. Not sure about Gotch/Hackenschmidt. I don't think it exists. It may have been filmed, though.

#47 jdw

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 07:16 PM

The second Hack-Gotch was filmed as it was talked about in terms of the cut each got from the match. Don't know about the first one. John

#48 Johnny Sorrow

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:25 AM

]
Verne being in that nursing home room which was cheap enough that he had a roommate suddenly makes more sense.


Actually, even in he most expensive of nursing homes most of the rooms are two person.

#49 rzombie1988

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 03:20 PM

Gotch/Hack was filmed. There were ads for it in the 50's in a magazine I read, but it hasn't been found yet.

#50 Tim Evans

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 01:46 AM

I'm reading Bobby Heenan's first book. He mentions a angle where Nick Bockwinkel put the Figure 4 on Gordon Solie in Atlanta. It got Solie fired for a couple weeks from Florida when Eddie Graham found out. I would love to see that.

#51 FLIK

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 12:13 PM

On a similar note, watching Finlay's shoot and he mentions having a singles match vs Fujiwara in NJPW in the early 80's as one of his standout matches in Japan. Guessing no footage of that exist tho which kinda sucks. #1 match I wish footage existed of is still the Daisuke Ikeda & Takashi Sugiura vs Kintaro Kanemura & Tetsuhiro Kuroda 60 min Iron Man from 03.

#52 KrisZ

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 12:23 PM

All the GCW TV from pre September 79 is holy grail stuff to me.

#53 jdw

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 12:56 PM

On a similar note, watching Finlay's shoot and he mentions having a singles match vs Fujiwara in NJPW in the early 80's as one of his standout matches in Japan. Guessing no footage of that exist tho which kinda sucks.


I would be interested in when Finlay toured NJPW. I don't see *any* listing of matches for him on Dan's 1974-83 NJPW listings (from an book/mag that had listings for every show) or his 1984-88 season sets. That would cover Fujiwara's time there.

Did Fit just never make TV in the 80s, or did he never tour?

John

#54 FLIK

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 04:11 PM

He said his 1st tour thear was in 82 and that Fujiwara was one of the first guys he wrestled. Told some stories about being on tour w the Funks and Dick Murdoch claiming to be Irish and trying to get Finlay to send him foreign dollars and coins because he was a collector.

#55 Guest_DWS_*

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 04:48 PM

Supposedly, Owen Hart did a few WWF matches in the spring of 1986 as jobber "Owen James". I believe they were all in places that never had TV cameras, so the best we could hope for is hand-held footage. Considering it was 1986 and video cameras back then were expensive and rare, I'd say it's next to impossible that we'll ever this. I'm not a big Owen Hart fan, but it'd be interesting to see, nonetheless. My personal favorite would be to see footage of the LOD-Money, Inc title swap from Denver, CO in February 1992. I don't think the WWF ever took cameras to their Denver stops, so it'd be the same situation as "Owen James". I've heard the LOD match dismissed as a "phantom swap that never happened", but I heard first-hand reports of the match; in February 1992; from people who went to the actual event.

#56 jdw

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 04:51 PM

Looking at Dan's list, which identifies gaijin on each tour, he didn't work for New Japan in 1982.

He does pop up in 1983 on one of Hisa's result pages:

http://www.puroresu....8307summer.html

Only match with Fujiwara:

1983/07/14 Sapporo - Nakajima Sports Center
Niikura def Yamazaki
Eigen & Arakawa def Yokpalsan & BAEK?
Halcon def Black Cat
Kido & Fujiwara def Roberts & Finlay
Sakaguchi & Kengo Kimura def Adonis & Blair
Toguchi (DCOR) Rusher Kimura
Abdullah (DQ) Murdoch
Sakaguchi & *Kengo Kimura (10:53 small package) Adonis & *Blair
WWF Junior Heavyweight Title: Tiger Mask* (16:52 DQ) Kuniaki Kobayashi
Choshu & Hamaguchi def Fujinami & Maeda

Probably what he's thinking of.

A lot of matches with Tiger Mask on the series.

I'd have to see if one of the old Super Book's had a list of his tours to see if there was another chance of a singles matches between the two.

John

#57 Graham Crackers

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 06:09 PM

A singles match between Finlay and Fujiwara is pretty appealing but that tag looks pretty great too. Finlay vs Kido sounds promising and I don't remember Roberts every wrestling Fujiwara. Did they wrestle each other in UWF?

#58 PeteF3

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 08:43 PM

Showapuroresu.com says that was his only NJPW tour pre-'90s. He did work in the UWF in 1985, but obviously wouldn't have met Fujinami there.

#59 Victator

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 09:40 PM

Best example of this is the first Super Bowl, as no full footage of the game exists (it got taped over by soap operas).

A full copy turned up last year. A station manager thought to tape it.

#60 KrisZ

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Posted 24 February 2012 - 10:50 PM

Yeah and it was supposed to air on NFL Network last year but has never happened.




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