GOTNW Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 What i find equally interesting is that he produced plenty of good work (and his best work naturally) when he was more restricted and more focused on playing a specific character than having great matches because he doesn't have the skillset to execute his vision of great wrestling. In the end he didn't really change that much from the kid who stole Ultimo Dragon spots. His career is probably the ultimate validation of Matt D's approach to reviewing wrestling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shrike02 Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Jericho is one of those people who thinks they are really intelligent, but are actually really dumb. This is a pretty unsupported and indefensible statement, by a fellow Canadian no less. Jericho probably isn't one of the top 100 because of his lack of consistency over the years, but he did a lot of good stuff over the years which outweighs the bad. Also, I think people are overlooking his genuinely awesome work on the mic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimmas Posted April 20, 2016 Author Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Jericho is one of those people who thinks they are really intelligent, but are actually really dumb. This is a pretty unsupported and indefensible statement, by a fellow Canadian no less. Jericho probably isn't one of the top 100 because of his lack of consistency over the years, but he did a lot of good stuff over the years which outweighs the bad. Also, I think people are overlooking his genuinely awesome work on the mic. Dumb in a wrestling sense, not as a person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Childs Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I love how often people play the "You're a Canadian" card on Steven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shrike02 Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I love how often people play the "You're a Canadian" card on Steven. For the record, I am also Canadian. I find it interesting that Steven is so down on Jericho - I believe he mentioned that Jericho would not make his top 200; whilst I'm sure if I were to compile a GWE list Jericho would probably shake down around 90-100, he would equally rate much higher on my favourites list. I think Jericho's biggest flaw is not that he was stupid in a wrestling sense, but that his mind wrote cheques his body and skills couldn't reliably cash. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Well that isn't exactly wrestling smart. How many years has he been trying to do athletic spots that he isn't athletic enough to do? I remember him bitching about fans calling him out for botching stuff back in like 2002 and yet in 2016 he's still wrestling that way and still botching stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Hase was a better wrestler than Jericho in basically every conceivable sense. I don't give Jericho a single thing he was better at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Jericho's work is more easily accessible. That counts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Accessible as in easy to get into or easy to find? Hase is probably the most accessible Japanese wrestler period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InYourCase Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Hase is probably the most accessible Japanese wrestler period. Uhhhh, how so? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I don't know if I'd call Jericho a smart worker. But he was a thinking worker. A constantly thinking, creative worker. The execution stuff is the absolute last thing I am going to care about. Never noticed it, never cared about it. Wrestling is symbolic, etc, etc. So I guess it says something that he's so bad at it now that it actually DOES bother me. But it took until 2016 for me to even notice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Hase is probably the most accessible Japanese wrestler period. Uhhhh, how so? I wrote about this in main GWE thread earlier. If you still have questions, I'll answer there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 He is definitely worse about it now than before. Before he was good for the occasional botch but now his timing is all over the place and his execution is bad. He and AJ wrestled each other a bunch of times and they didn't look on the same page in any of those matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackwebb Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 What i find equally interesting is that he produced plenty of good work (and his best work naturally) when he was more restricted and more focused on playing a specific character than having great matches because he doesn't have the skillset to execute his vision of great wrestling. In the end he didn't really change that much from the kid who stole Ultimo Dragon spots. His career is probably the ultimate validation of Matt D's approach to reviewing wrestling. I think that is why he usually came off as a parody of a great wrestler instead of being one himself. Turns out it was appropriate he used the Spinal Tap gag in WCW. Getting lost backstage. Since in a way he is a Spinal Tap parody come to life. Just he actually means it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WingedEagle Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Accessible as in easy to get into or easy to find? Hase is probably the most accessible Japanese wrestler period. Easy to find. Years of weekly TV matches + the Network. Hase required a whole lot more effort, but yes, his style and act should immediately translate even to fans unfamiliar with the Japanese product. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOTNW Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I honestly have no idea why Hase was brought up and what he has to do with Jericho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loss Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I think it was a comment on Jericho finishing above him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Yes and the irony of me calling Hase "like a Japanese Chris Jericho" a few months back. I was talking about utility and card positioning more than talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GOTNW Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Things have changed since 2006. The 2016 list is going to have drastically less japanese women, possibly less japanese wrestlers overall as well. Hase hasn't been a full time wrestler since, what, 1995/1996? Combine that with his run not being that long in the first place (I'd say it properly starts around 88 though I'm sure some would argue even later) and him not being a top level guy and I'm not really surprised. I'm sure Jericho got plenty of votes around PWO regulars-they just didn't do much to defend him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Yeah, I mean I voted for him and I've spent most of my time shitting on him because of his work in 2016. I like him a lot generally speaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I had Jericho on my list by the way and insanely high (#56). Talk about regret. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt D Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Yeah, I mean I voted for him and I've spent most of my time shitting on him because of his work in 2016. I like him a lot generally speaking. You must have put him fairly high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Redman Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 Yeah, I mean I voted for him and I've spent most of my time shitting on him because of his work in 2016. I like him a lot generally speaking. You must have put him fairly high. Just wait until you see what order I've put...him and the people around him in. I hate myself so much right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goc Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I had Jericho on my list by the way and insanely high (#56). Talk about regret. On what metrics did he get such a high BIGLAV score? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerryvonKramer Posted April 20, 2016 Report Share Posted April 20, 2016 I had Jericho on my list by the way and insanely high (#56). Talk about regret.On what metrics did he get such a high BIGLAV score? 6 5 4 7 7 6 Just scored in the mid-range across the board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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