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DR Ackermann

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We've talked about this with Loss already, but at some point in the next week, we'll be running down our own top 100s on WTBBP in audio form, however the printed versions will not be revealed.

One reason for this is we get a wide listenership outside of PWO who might be encouraged to put a ballot together after listening.

 

This raises an interesting point. We've been having discussions about this stuff for a year and a half now and I want the results to represent that and the varied opinions of people from PWO. Maybe others would disagree, but I don't like the idea of a bunch of people who have had nothing to do with the process showing up and submitting ballots in the last month of the project. As Loss has said in the past, PWO is not a monolith and people here have wildly differing opinions but they will have discussions and explain their points of view. I don't think we should be picky and choosy or elitist about who is allowed to vote or post here, but this deep into the project I don't want someone to come in with no thought put into a ballot and skew the results in a way that's not representative of the process and time people have put in.

 

Maybe some of you who make the decisions have already had this discussion and come to a conclusion about it. If not I think it's something that should at least be discussed.

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I don't believe in rejecting any voter, but I do believe the process is important. I would hope most of the voters would be people who have either participated publicly in the process, or at the very least have followed along and have been watching new things (I know several people like this who lurk here, including my brother Dustin who is likely to submit a ballot).

 

That said, I do worry a bit about the idea of thoughtless and/or spam ballots skewing the final results. The problem is that there is no real way to ensure against that.

 

I would also note that the public posting of ballots when things are said and done could potentially illustrate the differences between those who participated in a more public way and those who didn't (not saying either is more legitimate). And I look forward to that.

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I understand the concern, but, for example, I do not post often - I have only 170 posts or so despite being a member for almost 3 years - because I either don't feel as if I have anything to add, as people more knowledgeable than myself say the things I feel and in a much better way, or because I am mostly always short of time, but I have been following the project and the discussions since the very beginning, and it is quite possible that a lot of people who will vote/make accounts to vote will have done the same.

 

I do know a very good friend of mine who has been following the project and reading PWO for a very long time, but who was hesitant to create an account because he felt a bit underqualified as 99% of people have watched tons of more wrestling than he has. I know the feeling, because that is exactly what I used to feel and still do to some extent. Nevertheless, this project, and PWO in general, have got us to watch a lot of wrestling we would never have. And this project has also given him the final impetus to create an account and start posting.

 

I feel that more than being a comprehensive list, the worth of the project is not only in the discussions it will spawn, but also in people who will start posting here. start discussing their favourite wrestling, as well as get introduced to new wrestling, like I have. So, to that end, I do believe the project should have open nominations.

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We'll be able to dig in to the results in a lot of ways, and if there are weird ballots, I think they'll be easy to pick out. I also think that the ballots people fear will be included (ironic or trolling, whatever you want to call it) will be at a minimum. Some asshole will try and make his point but won't get the opportunity to toot his horn about it.

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One thing that has been suggested however is done drill down analytics with some separate results lists, and I support that.

 

And Steven designed a front sheet that should make it very easy to do. This is a way of being inclusive with the option at looking at more selective lists at the same time.

 

This.

 

People have put in a lot of time making this project happen. I'm guessing most of these people will have no problem taking some extra time with the results to break them out into separate lists. I know I'd be interested in seeing a top 100 made only using ballots from voters who regularly host podcasts on PWO-PTBN, or a top 100 made up of ballots using only the top 20 percent of posters in the GWE forum. Things like that.....

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We did do stats at the front of the ballot about if you participated during the 2006 vote, when you started watching, and what type of wrestling you considered for the list. Those will be easy to calculate. The other things like podcast hosts and stuff will be interesting too.

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I don't think that anyone that would be listening to WTBBP, hear their ballots, and then be inspired to fill out their own would be the kind of voters you have to worry about. Speaking for myself I listened to all the PWO-PTBN podcasts, watched tons of footage, and had similar debates over the years with other fans but, I didn't start posting regularly on PWO until I got involved with This Week In Wrestling I don't think you could easily write off my ballot as uninformed or naive to the process. The only problem I could see is if by some wildly insane stoke of luck the GWE project got posted on lets say wreddit and went viral thus having all the "I've seen GIFs" crowd put in ballots based on who's popular in NXT at the moment. Short of something in the elk you have to understand that even if the podcasts get more listenership than just the traffic on PWO that anyone listening to PWO podcasts are still the hardest of the hardcore wrestling fans many of whom may just not have the time or interest to posting on any board.

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Is there anything to prevent someone from submitting multiple ballots?

The forum says it prevents it, and you do have to enter a name. Not sure if it does it by IP address or if it's an honour system. If someone is making up fake names and changing their IP addresses to vote more than once, then I don't know what to say.

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It is the internet, and if someone really wanted to, they could cheat the system through some means. There is no point worrying about it too much. As it is, if someone goes to through great pains to affect a list about the 100 Greatest Wrestler Ever, done by a fringe board of an already niche entertainment form, that would honestly be more amusing than infuriating.

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It appears at least on the surface like the turnout for this might be higher than at least I would have initially guessed, which is a testament to the way the project has been organized and run to allow lots of leeway for creative thinking while still maintaining a sense of order, and also giving everyone the space to do their own thing. I'll admit I'm curious to see the results.

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^Co-signed on that. The organisation has been superb. Kudos to Grimmas, Loss and everyone else at the helm. This has been insanely fun. And for someone like me who is not so much knowledgeable about wrestling, this has been extremely educative too. When this thing started, I am pretty sure I had never heard of at least 30% of the wrestlers nominated.

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I'd opt for the ballots to be public and for at least having an account here be mandatory but I really don't see how that would be an isolationist policy. It's not like PWO is like WKO where people get dismissed based on having different opinions and get deleted for stupid reasons, everyone is welcomed. If we're doing this huge project then one of the end goals should be to get more people to participate in board discussion, and them explaining their lists could be a start of some interesting discussion. But it's not my call so whatevs.

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