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Looking for MDA suggestions

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#1 Loss

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Posted 15 December 2017 - 01:56 PM

Dylan made a thought-provoking tweet that I'd like to share. It raises interesting points, and I wanted to get some feedback from anyone who has it. 




In short, is there a way to use the Match Discussion Archive to make it easier to look at the big picture? So if you want to compare Portland in 1980 and 1985, for example, or two Intercontinental champions, or how various guys have worked cage matches, how can we make that easier? I don't want to overhaul the folder, nor do I think that's what Dylan is advocating. But I would like to find ways to better integrate it with everything else that happens here instead of it being a silo. I have some ideas, but a lot of it is limited by board technology, so I'm not sure where to go with it. So I thought I'd open the question up to everyone.


Tags are good and I'm a fan of tags, but they only work if we use the exact same naming conventions across the board. And even then, simply producing a list of threads isn't what I had in mind. I'd like something a little more intuitive if that's even possible.

#2 WingedEagle

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Posted 15 December 2017 - 02:29 PM

Its a great point and I agree with the general sentiment.  Tags are great for organizational purposes but not so much for fostering discussion.  I think the ideal situation is one that would allow for a broader discussion of matches / work / workers across eras / promotions / years or any other arbitrary and (il)logical basis, while somehow automatically cross-posting to an MDA for reference and narrow discussion / comments.


Yes, that may be entirely unhelpful given that it isn't exactly feasible.  But something along those lines seems like a worthwhile goal to spur more discussion of what's happening in the ring.  What about trying to establish broader threads along the lines of the weekly WWE TV or PPV threads.  I.e. "NJPW December 2017," "Wrestle Kingdom 12," "UK Indies November 2017," "EVOLVE 2017" or things of that nature, and then hoping or nudging people to cross-post in the MDA?  Perhaps too ambitious, but others may have a better idea of how to expand on this without taking away from the MDA.  Not exactly sure about how to tailor it to older material for these purposes, but surely there's a way.

#3 Loss

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Posted 15 December 2017 - 03:03 PM

Even then, I'd like people to have more freedom than even that, but yes, that's a good start. Wrestler, gimmick, title on the line, title change, city ... you name it. A filterable database I guess, but more of a platform for posting than just a database. I can't really visualize it, but I can imagine it.



    save all japan pro wrestling

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Posted 15 December 2017 - 04:20 PM

I don't see how it's the MDA's fault the rest of the board has nothing new to offer. And the rest of the board has nothing new to offer (other than occasional random BTB projects or whatever) because pretty much any single argument which could provoke a bigger number of poster to engage in it has already been beaten to death-it's just the nature of things when there's only so many posters watching only so much wrestling and they've crossed paths a million times.


If you're unhappy with how the MDA's affected the board think of cool projects or thought provoking ideas which could generate hype and discussion. For my money, by far the most interesting stuff on the board happens in the MDA-whether it be unearthing new/not well known matches or just a general creation of a consensus and a variety of opinions for certain matches for which you can't find something like that well organized and archived anywhere else on the internet. I vastly prefer the current state to the post-GWE state where basically nothing happened outside current WWE discussion, even if my dwindling enthusiastic for prowres doesn't really show it.

#5 dawho5

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Posted 16 December 2017 - 01:29 AM

I think it is up to the individual posters to make the board what they want.


Let's say you want a more detailed analysis of a single worker in 2017.  The tags would help you locate all of the match threads created.  You could conceivably start a post in The Microscope and go through matches chronologically using the MDA, even linking the threads for the matches you are discussing in the appropriate places.  This could apply to promotions, champions, periods of time from when we start to have footage to now, whatever.  It's more a matter of using the different areas of the board in conjunction.  It requires some homework on the part of the people posting, but my guess is that is actually a part of what is missing for the people who don't care for just using the MDA.


Most of what Loss would call the "more intuitive" stuff is going to be personal projects that people embark on to chronicle, let's say changes in the way matches were worked in Portland as the 1980s go on or whatever it may be.  The more in-depth projects that can use the resource of all of the match threads, but use those threads in the context of a larger perspective than just the individual matches.  There is no way to force that way of posting on anyone, just as there is no way to force the MDA on anyone if it doesn't work to their tastes.


One of the other things brought up is not having the same arguments with a new generation of posters.  I absolutely get that.  If I've already had an argument about something a few times I am pretty well done with it when it comes to people I talk to.  I just don't want to get into it and make the same points to yet another person.  But the problem with that issue is that if you want to go into these detailed overviews of wrestling over time, those same arguments will come up.  Maybe with some new perspectives, maybe not.  It's going to be a part of the process and something you have to go through to get what you want from posting the way you want.


I will say that for me, watching the Yearbooks 3-6 matches a day is a really fun way of watching wrestling.  I like seeing the different ways that promotions try to get their narratives across and how I react to them.  I'm becoming a big fan of guys like Foley, Austin and Pillman because I get to see them at fairly early stages of their career and see them move forward.  I'd like to say the same for Luger and Sting, but a lot of the fun of watching them try and improve is sucked out of the matches by the shit way they are presented by WCW.  And I will say that there are more than a few topics that i could really dig in on just from that aspect of it alone if I wanted to do a deeper dive into any one aspect of what I've watched so far.


The main point I wanted to make here is that board technology does not limit anyone from making themselves a project and posting about it.  I did that massively long AJPW 90s project with one thread.  It would have been better with the MDA and me going through and pulling highlights from other people's reviews of the match from the MDA.  But the board is what it has always been.  It is a tool we all use for what we want.  If you find yourself not using it, ask yourself what you want to use it for and do that.

#6 G. Badger

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Posted 16 December 2017 - 11:24 AM

Man, everyone has made really great points. Anything I say here is as someone who has lurked longer than been a member.

I actively started checking out PWO when the 1996 yearbook was getting underway. Checking in on a daily basis to see what everyone was saying, getting recommendations, etc. It was great watching each year get filled with more views, discussions and so on was awesome.

I really should have signed up back then but, my life circumstances at the time would have made it difficult. Nevertheless, I finally got on board and since I mainly watch older stuff and have like a 200 page long word doc of reviews, I'm all about sharing in the MDA yearbooks.

I feel the MDA now serves more as a reference source than a forum for discourse. The emphasis is more on Match Archive than Match Discussion... at least for everything pre 2015. I'm not sure newer folks even scroll down to check it anymore. They may just click straight to the main page or the current WWE forum.

The 90s yearbook sets that folks watched helped keep that discussion going and gave context and organization but, for the 1920s-80s & 2000s-2010s especially, its kinda the wild west. So, people may shy away from posting or create topics without a consistent format.

I think the best thing is to encourage people that create new topics in the MDA to tag the hell of it. Have a minimum or standardized tag "requirement." At least the names of the participants, any AKAs (if known), the promotion, belt/title defended, and specific tour/annual event name like Royal Rumble or G1 Climax. Hopefully, those things would provide some cross reference even if someone's spelling or spacing is off. Any topic on the main forums, the above but, add a year tag too.

IDK if any admin can add or edit tags retroactively but, I see topics in the MDA with no tags or with just a name or two. That bums me out a little...

Also, adding links or at least cross referencing other posts within your post is good practice that I don't see often enough anymore but, it helps synthesize the board as reference source and forum.

I don't know if you can or want to "enforce" the tagging but, folks may just need a little direction, guidance, or even reminder now & again. That way there's relatively consistent board organization and perhaps clearer research & discussion pathways.

I hope this helps :)

#7 AstroBoy

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Posted 16 December 2017 - 08:18 PM

I think I get where Dylan is coming from and he has a point but I'm not sure I have a great answer or solution.  I know that for myself, it's been somewhat easy to get involved on the board a little more through match discussion and projects that usher that kind of involvement.  Sort of like it might be easier to cover a live event for a newspaper instead of unleashing an editorial. . . sometimes it might be a little daunting to approach some huge narrative discussion until you feel more comfortable on this board.


That said, I don't know an obvious solution.  My instinct tells me maybe there should be some way to combine or merge the microscope stuff with the MDA stuff.  Maybe keep the match discussion threads and subforums and add on another section that could cover microscope projects, comparisons, philosophical discussions of style, time, region, etc.  Basically any longer form projects that could spawn from match discussion.  And the two could feed into one another.  Just a loosely formed idea.

#8 alexoblivion

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Posted 19 December 2017 - 08:58 PM

I don't know, seems like some of the more active posters of the past have just simply moved on to Twitter as their chosen platform for their wrestling discussion needs.

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